From Olympic Pressure to Peace and Purpose

Katie Hoff1:49

No, Shelby has Oh, well, you know about the I still have to give her back her little lucky thimble.

Katie Hoff1:54

That she gave me and I have it on my nightstand that's supposed to bring fertility luck and I brought it to the IVF to the egg transfer and it obviously worked so.

Katie Hoff2:40

We waited a long time intentionally. Like I mean we moved 10 times in 10 years and I just feel like it was so so transition from sport into careers and we both of us were never like I don't I I don't think we're ready. Like for almost 10 years and then we got to Nashville three years ago. I think that was the first time where we were like wow, I feel like we feel settled. It doesn't feel like we're looking to the next city and so it was kind of the first time where we both looked at each other like hmm, like maybe we start trying and so we essentially tried a full year which was really hard because I do feel like it always at least for me I felt like it was all on me.

Like oh, I'm just too high strung. I'm too stressed. Like that's why we're not getting pregnant. And then

Katie Hoff3:25

Not at all. No, I mean I I think I mean even Shelby opening up and telling me about her struggles.

Like I just think information is power. It makes you not feel alone. So I'm like people are like, oh, I don't know if I should I'm like ask me anything. I will tell you everything. And ours is different in the fact that one I wish that we had done testing right away. Like Todd does the sauna like 5 hours a day. His sperm count was super low. And so when we went through that process of testing after kind of not having luck for a year, we found out that we have this crazy genetic mutation called PMM2 that essentially means like we have a one in four chance of having a child that like barely makes it past like 5 years old.

Wow. And so finding that out was like very surreal. The doctor called I remember and was like stop trying naturally. Like we need to get his sperm count up, but stop trying naturally. You guys have to do IVF. And that was a I don't feel like it was 50/50. It was like kind of like a relief cuz I was like, okay, well, we found answers. Like I can't I don't know how you guys did it where you didn't ever have an answer.

Katie Hoff5:07

There was one time where Todd was dog sick. And I'm looking at my app tracking it and he's like, babe. I'm like, no.

Me upstairs and find your figure it out. Like so romantic. But yeah, we essentially then had to go through the another year of just all the testing and all the pre-work and getting He was on terrible hormones that made him like you look back to pictures last year he said eyes are bloodshot he gained like 20 pounds like he had to do his part as well in this in this process and then finally we got so so lucky in the fact that we did one egg retrieval

Yeah. and we did one embryo transfer and

Katie Hoff6:05

Retrieval was a pain in the ass. Pain yes it I mean it was just stressful because it just felt like everyone's saying like you know you're probably going to do multiple rounds of this and of course I'm so impatient at this point. I'm like no I want it to work the first time and yeah we got 24 eggs that then boils down to you know two embryos tested the embryos we had a boy and a girl they asked which one we wanted and I was like well what's the stronger one and they said the girl and I was like obviously then they transferred the girl and nine days later took the pregnancy test and was pregnant.

Did you contemplate doing both? They so nowadays it depends I think on doctor philosophy but they don't they feel like it's a better chance to do it. So I I always say I'm like we have a boy on ice for three K rents and so that'll be we'll definitely transfer for the second give me a couple years but um yeah just feel so grateful that I feel like relative to what most people experience in their fertility journey had it pretty easy.

Katie Hoff7:05

Yeah so far so good and yeah I was definitely like baby the heck out of myself I was like what you know I had this question of like okay obviously I want to push myself in this run or I want to push myself in this workout and then I'm like for what though like it wasn't worth the risk and so I feel like I was you know having that athlete intense mentality I've been really good about keeping in a perspective and being like it's not about me anymore.

Yeah. Like it's about her and if there's even a 1% risk that I'm going to affect her health,

Katie Hoff7:47

Out though regularly. Working out regularly. I was telling you before we hopped on, it's very uh just awful because every time I run or do like a fitness class, I'm just so winded. Like I feel like I'm like a out of shape person who hasn't worked out in years, which is obviously not the case. So that's a little frustrating, but

Katie Hoff8:11

I know. It's Yeah, it's like I lived the same way for 36 years and suddenly it's like every Even walking up the steps, I'm like, "Oh my god, I got to go up the steps." Like It's just It's such a a shift, but I feel like I feel like I'm handling it really well. Like I didn't know how I would handle it, but I feel like I'm kind of in the stage where I'm like, "Okay, this is is what it is. It's short It's a short period of time and look what I get at the other side of it." And so I've been able to keep it in perspective relatively well.

Not perfectly well, but relatively well.

Katie Hoff9:15

Yeah. I mean, that's going to be a toss-up with Todd cuz Todd's obsessed with our Frenchie, but I feel like it's been fun to see his relationship with our female dog, which sounds crazy, but I'm like it's going to be a hundred x with the his daughter. So I'm really looking forward to how he's going to be. Knowing how much of a softy you are around your daughter, like Todd is going to be the same.

Katie Hoff10:03

Scored a goal. Wow. It's crazy.

Katie Hoff10:48

Yeah. Like that's a lesson in life.

Katie Hoff11:48

I was born in California, Sunnyvale, so Northern California, and then we moved West Coast when I was 5. So, I would say like I was born in California, but like grew up pretty much the majority of my childhood in Virginia and Baltimore.

Katie Hoff11:48

Yeah, North Baltimore Aquatic Club. I joined I mean, I kind of dabbled around, but joined North Baltimore Aquatic Club when I was just turned 14.

So, a year out of 2004, which I instantly was like matchmade in heaven with the coach. Like I'm someone that like don't be asked me, give me the numbers, give me the data, and like that instantly is what he gave me. And so, not thinking that, you know, a year out from 2004, I was going to then be making the 2004 team, but that's what happened. And it was just like this crazy wild ride to my first Olympics.

Katie Hoff12:49

Not at all. Were they athletes? So, my mom was she's I think she's still third time all point scorer at Stanford in basketball. Oh, wow. She went to Stanford, too?

Yeah, my mom was a badass. And yeah, and my dad got his master's from Stanford. So, they're both yeah. Jeez. I know. I'm like, I don't know. I inherited some of their smarts, but I definitely inherited my you know, my just my mom's like kind of killer mentality, competitive, and I really just got into swimming cuz I saw kids in the neighborhood doing it. There's this one kid I thought was so cool. And I was I asked my mom, can I try it? So, that's that's literally how it all happened.

Um, and I really I get that kind of like killer mentality, I would say. I've been made fun of like till nine. People are like, "Nine?" I'm like, "But still, it was like took four years and at nine I kind of realized, oh wait, like this is a race. Some people are winning, some people are losing." And it just kind of all clicked for me of like, "Okay, like I love this feeling and this feeling is addictive." And I broke my first state record at nine.

At that point it was like, "Let's go.

Katie Hoff13:48

I think 10. Like 10 was when I really started consistently beating everybody in the state. When I just turned 11, I watched the 2000 Olympics on TV. And I remember

Sydney? Sydney, yeah. And I remember just thinking, which Sydney is like the mecca of swimming. So like the Aussies are just so passionate about that sport and I just remember watching going like, "I need to I need to be an Olympian." Having, which I just actually said this in an interview, like ignorance is bliss at that point. Like you had no idea what the road looked like to get there, but I just remember being like, "No, like I have to do that. Like I have to have Team USA on my cap." Oh, that's so awesome.

Katie Hoff14:45

North Baltimore. So I kind of had this like steady progression. It's like in swimming you make it's all about like the cuts that you get. So it's like at 13 I made my Olympic trial cut and then which people always, it's my biggest pet peeve pet peeve. People are like, "Oh, the Olympic trial cut. Oh, Olympic hopeful." I'm like, "They're 70th at that point. You have to be top two." But had the cut and then I kind of just outgrew my club in Virginia.

Katie Hoff15:09

here." I mean I tried to beat the 16-year-old guys, basically. Yeah.

Katie Hoff15:20

her." In some ways, yes, but I think that's the beauty of being a girl. Like, there's always a guy that's going to be faster than you, which was kind of isolating. You're 13-year-old girl, imagine 10 say being a 13-year-old girl, you know, competing with 16-year-old dudes, which like, I got bullied a lot.

Like, but I I was feel like I was very ignorant to that. Like, they would constantly mess with me. I loved it. I was like, "Yeah, you're going to mess with me? Well, I'm going to beat you and embarrass you." So, that it got to a point though where I just felt like I needed I needed girls and I wanted to have more of just a community and a friendship. And so, my dad's job was moving to Maryland anyways and so, we we sought out North Baltimore Aquatic Club and went and visited the team and contrary to popular belief, everyone thought, "Oh, so you were trained by Michael Phelps' coach." Which we were at an offsite um kind of practice site and so, I was coached by a different coach and he and I just just hit it off right away in just terms of our communication and how he operated with me and I was like, "Sold.

Katie Hoff16:33

And who was that? His name's Paul Yetter. How old were you when you went there? I just turned 14. So, I'm we're a year out now from 2004 and I'm and I at that point, I remember sitting down and having a goal meeting with him and looking at him and saying, "I just want to make the final. If I can be top eight in my events, that'll set me up great for 2008, have some good experience and I'm happy with that." And throughout that those next 12 months, I just every time I got in the water was in like improving gobs of time and like by 3 months out, I remember looking at him and being like, "I'm ranked top 10 in the nation right now.

Like, I'm going from like looking at these idols to now realizing I might have to beat my idols and I am beating my idols. It it was a a really like a a cluster in my head of kind of it happened so fast and I didn't feel fully prepared for it.

How tall were you? How tall was I? I was so skinny, but I think I was like 5 8.

So you were like of like a full-grown woman at 14 or 15 years old cuz Shelby's 5 8. I mean, I was tall, but I was I was teeny. Like I looked like a little If you look up pictures, you're like that girl has not 1 oz of body fat and has not gone through puberty. Okay. Okay. Yeah, like I look like a a tall little boy. Okay. So talk me through going through the trials cuz this is like such a dream scenario for most kids who are swimmers especially.

Katie Hoff18:08

So and it's so hard to describe without sounding mean. Like I feel like a lot of times Todd takes over because people are like, "Yeah, like my kid swims." and I'm like, "No, but like this wasn't just like a hobby. This was like my whole soul and being." Like this was like I I I thought about it every second. It was everything I put into my mouth, every all my sleep. Like I was like at 14 years old like obsessed. Um so going to I mean going to trials I was really excited, but also terrified.

I mean, I'm I just turned 15 years old. I'd never been to an Olympic trials before. I'm racing again like people are there that I had posters on their wall 3 years before.

And where are the trials? They're out in Long Beach, California. Okay. So your your family flew out there with you?

My My family flew out there and I get to the first race and get so excited and so hyped that I take the race out too fast and I promptly gain 10 seconds in the prelims and I'm like, "It's over. Like that's it. I screwed up." Luckily slip into the final, like sixth place, recoup in the matter of 3 hours, and then come back that night.

Was the race? 400 IM, which is like Oh, that's the worst race.

Like the most And the 400 IM in in my life has always kind of been this metaphor of like this beast that I had to kind of conquer. And it always gave me such I feel like you could kind of compare it to probably not the length of time of a marathon, but there's so much strategy and pain into it.

And so, I would always be so nervous about the strategy and like hitting it right, and it took me a really long time to figure that out. And I just I was young. I was 15 years old, and so, in a matter of like 5 hours, somehow regrouped, had a Subway sandwich, talked to my coach.

Katie Hoff20:07

Yeah, but think You have to think back 2004. That stuff was not being Like, Subway was healthy back in 2004.

Katie Hoff20:21

Starts with butterfly, which is the hardest. So, 100 fly, 100 back, 100 breast, 100 free.

Katie Hoff20:21

fish." Yeah, I feel like it's a very impressive stroke to watch, especially when you're smooth, and yeah, I mean, butterfly the first half for me was never my absolute best.

I always made a move on the back half, but my thing was like being really relaxed going out the first 100, and that's what I did at night, and up winning the race.

Katie Hoff20:59

The pressure's kind of off." Yeah, honestly it was the best thing that could have happened to me that I screwed up in the morning because it was like, "Well, there's all these expectations for me to make the Olympic team.

I've kind of screwed that up. So let me just go in here and and do my best." Which by the way, I'm racing the girl that I had watched on TV in Sydney. And so it was just like this

Uh Kaitlin Sandeno. Okay. She was 17 in Sydney. I remember idolizing her and then we're in the final together. Like I I feel like people I don't want to skip over that. Like people think about like your idol in whatever sport you watch and now think about like suddenly coming up against them and having to compete against them for a top spot. Like it is such a flip of your mind you have to kind of just almost I almost feel like I had to pretend she wasn't who she was.

Like she was just another swimmer.

Katie Hoff22:01

Uh I mean, in swimming it's it's not like fighting or, you know, running where you're like jostling. It's pretty tame. So you're lining up in, you know, the kind of the ready room. I wasn't a talker in the ready room. Like I didn't love to especially in the 400 IM, I kind of kept to myself, but yeah, we definitely weren't like joking around. I didn't really know I didn't really know that many people.

Um and I just yeah, I mean, you know, I remember being like terrified out of my

Katie Hoff22:33

Yeah, it was kind of best case scenario for me. Um cuz I was way out I was in lane seven. Yeah, lane seven and the top girls were in lane three and four and five.

Yeah. So I I yeah, I remember starting the race and being like, "Okay, like don't do the same thing. Relax." Um ended up hitting my butt on the wall in the backstroke, which is the second leg. So, I'm like that was stupid.

Katie Hoff23:06

And then I remember pulling away on the first leg of breaststroke, so we're at the 250 now,

Yeah. looking, which you're not supposed to do, off the wall heading into the 300 and seeing clear water, like not seeing anybody, and being like, holy crap, this is happening.

Yeah. And you know, 400 IM is so painful, but I actually was smiling on the last 50

Yeah. of the 400 of the race because I'm like, I I think I'm about to make my first Olympic team.

Katie Hoff23:38

Yeah, which was a lot. So, like I came to the wall and it wasn't even like a question. I'm just like, holy [ __ ] I'm an Olympian, you know?

Katie Hoff23:53

Yeah. No, they're freaking out and I remember turning around seeing number one next to my name and then seeing who was like the ultimate idol. She had the American record at the time and she was in the stands, Summer Sanders.

Yeah. And seeing that they like put her face like watching me. She's since become a really good friend, but being like, oh my god, my idol just saw me win the race and beat I was right off the American record at the time. Oh my god.

Katie Hoff24:40

Oh, that's like all I'm like, that's all I just want all of the free stuff. And you get two sets. You get from the United States Olympic and Paralympic Committee and then you also get from Team USA. So, you get two sets of outfitting. So, the the weird part back then, now they allow people to go home, but you make the team and then literally I had to have my mom send me a huge box of clothes, cuz I'm not going to pack for the team before I go, just out of superstition, and you don't get to go home.

Really?

Go to They allow this now, but as a as a 15-year-old, I'd never been away from my parents more than 3 days. I'm I finish out the competition cuz I had the 200 IM later that meet, which I also won. And then it's like, yeah, we're now going to go into training camp uh in Palo Alto as a team.

Yeah. And you're just like in training camp, and then

Katie Hoff25:31

Yeah. Hang hanging with adults. Um I'm and I'm such a naive 15-year-old. Like, I just and I'm so reactive, and so like the boys picked up on that immediately. So, like there was a lot of just I don't know, like making making fun, and there even some girl bullies on the team.

Katie Hoff25:48

Yeah, which have since apologized to me, which is nice, but it was really really hard. Like, I don't feel like back then, and they have all this now, like they didn't have a set sports psych, they didn't have just the infrastructure and support that you would think you'd have for a teenage girl traveling you know, traveling across the world without her parents, without her coach.

Katie Hoff26:16

Mainly because I'm worried about other people.

Katie Hoff26:16

Yes. Yes. So, that was like now looking back, obviously you're in you're in it. You're just like trying to fight and figure it out. But yeah, I mean, you're going from Palo Alto camp, we then fly to Majorca, Spain to do another training camp. We're there for a little bit, and then we fly to Athens to check into the village. And at this point, I mean, I'm I'm trying to figure out like my dial-in like calling card international phone.

Like, there's no cell phones back then. And I'm just breaking down because I I miss my parents. I miss And so, yeah, it was really really difficult like outside of the swimming part is just like the lead up to it. It was just emotionally draining cuz I just was so taken out of my normal routine. Like I don't think people realize like you train one way and you have a lead up one way to be at your best and then suddenly you're about to go compete at the Olympic Games where you need to be your best again and you have none of the same things.

So it was it was a very it was very tumultuous time.

Katie Hoff27:15

Yeah, that which is where your mind is is going and like I remember even I was so excited to get the tattoo like the Olympic tattoo and I remember saying to one girl I'm like, oh my gosh, I was like you should just like pretend she was like 30. So I was like you should just pretend to be my mom like and I can go get it and she like ripped my head off like was freaking out cuz I called basically was calling her old but I'm like you are She could be a mom.

Yeah, I know. So it just I just felt so out of my social element.

Katie Hoff27:59

You're not. No, and I like I said I think they they've made some changes and you know, I I was just an anomaly where I was just like one of the youngest on the team by a lot. Like some of those girls are 16, 17 but they were in high school and they you know, knew about boys and like you know, I was like literally like fresh-faced like I don't know anything and that was very apparent. So And you didn't have to have a boyfriend or anything.

No, I never kissed a boy. I didn't have my license. I like I mean I like it was like I was a child.

Katie Hoff28:39

Oh yeah, I mean it's like not a good situation. Not a good situation. No, no and I like I remember even going into the village and like we had there was like a meeting cuz someone like the Olympic Village rumors are like all true. Like it is chaos in there. And so

Katie Hoff29:05

Well, I mean there's this I was just in London they were talking about this Speedo host this infamous party in '08 where all the basketball guys came. Like we were all done and they all came to the party and yeah they swimmers have great bodies and like

Katie Hoff29:26

It's it's crazy. So yeah so like think about like even at the time that I was 19 in my second games but like they first games just like we had a meeting and they were like someone got caught having sex on the balconies. Like we need to and I'm sitting there like is this normal? Like what's happening? So it was a culture shock. It was a mental shock. It was like I'm thinking it was also my first national team. So I hadn't swam at worlds. I hadn't and so I'm like is this what it's like?

Like is this how it operates? Like am I guess I'll have to figure it out but crazy especially looking back.

Katie Hoff31:11

I can't screw up in the prelims like I did the trials. I'm not going to make the final. And just like this this onward like working myself up for basically 6 weeks. And so I get to the prelims of the 400 IM. Day one, it's like after the prelims

Katie Hoff31:28

Oh, there's all the media yeah talking about like, you know, teen phenom, you know, I think God social media wasn't a thing back then. I could not have handled it. I really like there was like chat boards and I'm like I I looked at those and those were hurting enough. I don't know how kids do this with the comments today, but yeah, I essentially had this pressure of like I'm supposed to win a medal for my country and I get into the prelims and I just I felt like I was literally like watching myself from above swim it and ended up not making the final.

Ended up having I tell people all the time like imagine like you're having a nightmare before like a really big event whether it's a presentation or a race and like something goes like really crazy wrong and you wake up and you're like, oh thank God that was a dream. Mine was literally like a reality where I was in so much pain from the race that I got out, threw up all over the pool deck, had su- reporters and photographers surrounding me taking these pictures and that was my Olympic debut.

Yeah. That's the definition of resilience. Yeah, I always say I'm like, well, I kind of got like a really big failure out of the way at 15. So after that it's like, well I can only go up from here. But it was I mean for probably about a year when you Googled my name it was a picture of me vomiting on the pool deck. Oh my god. Which is like you're already insecure enough at 15.

A 15-year-old kid. Like god. So and and I did bounce back. I was really proud of that. Like I came back for the the 200 IM and like I made the final and I didn't medal but I still was seventh in the world at 15 years old. And so it was like kind of a good like, okay you stepped forward a little bit. You saw your Olympic Games. And then it was like this road of like, all right, like is this thing beating you? Are you done?

Are you out? Or like are you going to go for I kind of called it my redemption tour of like, no no, like this wasn't luck. I was down and out for a little bit but like, let's go and let's figure this out. And that's really what then prompted the next four years of just like American records, world records. Like I kind of came back with a vengeance because I was like, no I'm I'm here to stay.

Katie Hoff33:42

Well, that's another thing. So the way it works with like Olympic team coach selection is, you know, you have your your heavy hitter coaches that have been around for a long time. And then maybe have some personal coaches if the athletes more tenured or they're swimming a lot of events, which is me in 2008. But not in 2004. So I had my personal coach Paul through only the US training camp. We flew to Mallorca and he wasn't there.

We flew to Athens, he wasn't there. He couldn't go to the Olympics? He was not allowed on the pool deck. As soon as the catastrophe happened they were like, we need to get this coach on the pool deck. And so then he was able to kind of come on the deck and support me and and talk me through. Like it was literally like, all right, let's get in the water. Let's swim. Let's just feel good in the water. And then I take took very baby steps and I only had 48 hours to kind of like

Yeah. recoup. And it was just like, okay, let's take one race at a time. Prelims, get through it. Semifinals, get through it. And there's actually this like really wonderful moment in the semifinal. I win my heat and like I actually like turn around and like smile like on NBC. And it's just like really positive moment in in all the hell that was happening. But um yeah, it was just I I felt like I needed to be baby at that that point. I needed someone to just like be like, okay, like let's take one step in front of the other.

Katie Hoff35:26

Which is like I feel like I've recently been put into perspective more of like I have friends where they have 15-year-old kids and I'm looking at them operating the world and I'm like, how in the world was I going to the Olympics and handling this pressure? And it's actually made me give myself more grace over the years because of course like I still, you know, for the longest time look back on that and I'm like, uh you know, like but it's now I'm thinking of when I have a 15-year-old daughter, holy crap, if she was, you know, if she was going across the world and doing all these things.

So yeah, I I needed babying, but I think the thing I'm always the most proud of from that is I just didn't let it I had probably a week after we got back of kind of grieving, feeling sorry for myself. And then it was like, meet with my coach. Okay, how can I not be afraid of this race? And how can we move forward and I show people that I'm, you know, I'm not just like a flash in the pan one one-hit wonder. And it was all like he basically just crushed me for a year in training.

Because for me, there's some people that I feel like, and I feel like you're the same way, that you can be like, "Oh, well, just like think positively, and like you can do it." And I'm like, "No, no, no, like, I need a prove in like actual data, like, this is why I'm ready." And so, everything we did, I mean, I was recording things down to the hundredth of a second. I was um meticulous in making sure that when I was standing behind the blocks for the next 400 IM, there was no doubt in my mind that I was

Katie Hoff37:23

I mean, we had an I had, you know, a parade for me, we had parties. Um it was hard though, because I think it was my first experience with this, and this is like a trend in my life throughout, where everyone else is so excited for me, and inside, I'm in so much pain cuz I'm not excited for me.

Yeah. You know that pressure where you like I have to I feel like I need to put on a good face cuz I don't want to make them uncomfortable. And which is so emotionally draining, and just not authentic, but I just remember thinking like, but I I need to smile, and I need to feel I I should feel proud of myself, when inside I'm like, I'm not proud of myself. Like, I didn't want to just become an Olympian, I wanted to be, you know, an Olympic medalist.

And so, now looking back, it's like, wow, that has been a such a trend in my life where I'm constantly battling how I'm feeling about something versus how others are feeling. So, it was it was tough. I mean, I still look back at those pictures, and I'm like, I'm faking a smile at this, you know? But it It really I mean, it's really cool. Like, I had the key to the city. I had a parade and you know, was overwhelmed with love from teammates and family.

And so that of course was was really meant a lot.

Katie Hoff38:33

So there was about a year lap time. So back then there was no NIL obviously. So it was either like if you're going to take money, you're going to be turning professional and you're forgoing your college eligibility.

And so obviously at that point I'm still 15. It wasn't quite in the thoughts there, but I do remember there's this weird rule back then where like you could take money from one big meet a year, which seems so not right, but you could. And I remember getting in the mail a $10,000 check for my seventh place at the Olympics and not having any idea from the Olympic committee. And I remember like as a 15-year-old kid $10,000 is $10 million. And so I remember being like what?

Like I didn't know I was going to get this. And it was my first taste of like wow, that felt really good. Like feeling like there's this outside, you know, confirmation of success. Good, bad, or indifferent. But when all that happened was at the World Championships in 2005 a year later, I had the I mean, I won three gold medals. I broke my first American record. I was on fire. Then I was getting approached by agents and brands and it was basically I had to decide like am I going to waste these three years of like prime earning abilities or do I wait till 18 and decide to go to college and swim in college?

Katie Hoff40:21

It was tough because I was just I feel like if I'd been maybe 17 at the time, it would have been a little harder of a decision of like, okay, maybe I go for 2 years. But I'm like, I'm in Everyone was like, you're in your prime or in approaching your prime right now.

Yeah. And so for me, and again, like my parents didn't have tons of money. Like they weren't a They weren't a country club family where it was easy for them to go to meets and pay for hotels and all these things. And so I just remember meeting with the agent who was Michael Phelps' agent and talking about what this could mean. Um Speedo offered to pay for my college, so

Um and then negotiating this 10-year deal that no one had ever had before. And obviously a lot of it was a based off potential, but it felt it never felt like nerve-wracking to me. I was just I was excited. I was motivated where like there were these benchmarks in my contract where it was like, if you hit this time, you get a $50,000 bonus. And I was like, a 16-year-old kid, I was like, hell yeah. I want that 50.

So I still don't regret the decision. I think it helped set up my future. I think it was the perfect time in the market. Um yes, I don't know what it's like to swim at NCAA's, but I also got in return so many cool experiences with brands and crazy trips and and so those memories are,

Katie Hoff41:30

So I signed Speedo was the 10-year deal. I signed with Visa. I signed with Omega. I signed with Rosetta Stone.

Yeah, like I One, my agent was a killer. And two, like it was 2005. So like before everything that happened in 2008, like it was like every every company was like, whoa. Like market's good. I was this up-and-coming phenom. I was getting compared to Michael Phelps. Like, it was just the time everything lined up that it just made sense for

And who was managing the money, your dad? My dad and then a lawyer, yeah. Yeah, they'd put, you know, they they were smart about it. They'd be like, all right, here's your little amount that you can go with and like have fun and buy your first pair of Chanel glasses. Yeah.

Yeah. But a lot of it just went into like, you know, invested, yeah. Cuz like that I remember the contract was it was like 27 pages. Like, how could I even, you know, I I didn't know any of that stuff. Like, that was all being managed for me, but

Yeah. definitely see how if you're not in a family that is supportive, like how things can just go awry because there's so much coming in that you're just like not aware of. I'm just a 16-year-old kid going to swim practice and training.

Katie Hoff43:04

So, who's doing it, your mom? So, at first it was my mom and then we got into major fights cuz I would be like, that's not a B, that's an A on this paper. At the point of ninth grade, we wanted to have college transcripts and so I just enrolled, it's called American School, enrolled in like a home school program that

Okay. was like very strict and like would grade everything.

Okay. So, yeah. I was just going home school, but then I still got to go to prom and homecoming from swimming was my social.

Katie Hoff43:25

Uh no, it was just like a boy on our team invited me to go to prom.

Oh, oh, well, I got you. Yeah, yeah. So, I still felt like I got the social aspect of being a 16, 17, 18-year-old girl and um it allowed me to be flexible with training and you know, travels with brands or sponsors and or big meets, so it kind of worked out.

What happens after you come back? So, then the four years builds up to the next Olympic Games. You're like smashing everything. You're winning everything. So, going So, this is now what the 2008 Um where was that one? Beijing. Beijing. All right. So, what happens in Beijing? So, yeah, like you said, like the lead-up it's almost like I I went from, you know, here, like mid-range Not mid-range, but like, you know, I go to 2004, and then suddenly I make this big jump, where now I'm not swimming just two events.

I'm possibly going to make the Olympic team in five individual events. And so, all these comparisons to Mr. Phelps start coming in, which honor, right? Obviously, greatest Olympian of all time, but not necessarily fully warranted. Like, he had seven world records, you know, I had one world record.

Yeah. I just wanted a gold medal. That's it. And so, um I go to the Olympic trials, which is again 6 weeks before 2008, win every single event, break two American records back-to-back, 30 minutes apart, world record in the 400 IM, like the meat of my freaking life. Like, nothing could go Like, still to this day, no female has ever won five individual events. Like, five Like, I was like five for five.

Yeah. Um feeling really good, and you know, we were able No, we still weren't able to go home. So, we go right to training camp. At this point, I had packed some stuff.

Katie Hoff45:15

I mean, they had a documentary around me. Like, there was so much I mean, that Matt Lauer came to my pool.

Like, flew out for the Today show. Like, there was I mean, it was all kind of culminating and happening. And, you know, at this point, I'm feeling confident. Like,

Yeah. But, at the same time, I knew, okay, like I had traded the world record back and forth between this Aussie girl.

Okay. You know, the competition was stiff. It wasn't like I was going in being like, "Oh, I've got gold medals. It's a big deal." And so, uh you know, training camp went really well. Get there and trying to describe the meet it it felt like there was just so many near misses, but when I look back the meet, like I didn't have a bad meet. Like the first day was a 400 IM. I went half a second off of my world record, which like is milliseconds for the race.

And it just happened on that day two girls were faster. And so I got my first Olympic medal, bronze. And I walk over to the mixed zone and the media is like, "Are you upset?" Like, you know, like I'm I'm just getting like kind of attacked from the media.

Really? Okay, well like, you know, I still have nine days to go. I still have four more races. And like, yeah, I compared to what happened last time, I'm feeling good. I just won it my first Olympic medal for my country.

Katie Hoff46:41

Yes, it was such a And then day two, I'm swimming the 400 free, which was not a I would say I had the American record in it, but it wasn't like a standout like I was in the IM.

Get touched out by 700ths of a second for gold, win silver. But again, I'm like, "Great." Like I'd never even medaled internationally in this event. Awesome. Go into I now have a double. I'm like swimming every single day, which is not normal. End up breaking the American record in the 200 free, but I I get fourth. So like it's like, "Great swim, but not good enough." And then the 200 IM is like I swam it 30 minutes later. Was not a good swim for me. Our relay, I anchor in the fastest ever time by an American.

We break the world record, but so do two other teams. So it's just like it it wasn't a this terrible meet, although in my mind it was this terrible meet. But when I look back, I'm like it was really good swims. I won three medals, but I left that meet feeling like a full-blown failure. Like feeling like

Katie Hoff48:14

Yeah, it was amazing.

Katie Hoff48:17

Yeah, which is funny cuz if you look at uh Paris in 2024, they Yeah, they messed up and made the pool too short. Like, they're not short, but too shallow.

Katie Hoff48:26

Yeah. And so the Yeah, the I mean, the pool was super fast. I felt great in it. Um but I I think, you know, one, I probably If I went back, I probably wouldn't swim as many individual races. It was just like what my coach felt like was best, and I was going to listen to him. But but, you know, the Olympics is way different. You're getting You're getting blood tested. You're getting drug tested. You're doing press conferences. You're walking to the Like, there's so many outside logistics that you don't experience at trials that is draining.

And so Yeah, I I just remember the media kind of attacking me a lot and just feeling like not proud of Like, people would ask to see my medals for probably 10 years, and I didn't want to show them. Yeah.

Um but now I have some, you know, pride in it and all that. But yeah, I I think very different experiences, but just the Olympics just were never where I was hitting it like perfectly star aligned.

Katie Hoff49:08

I decide to So, throughout that experience in 2008, my coach was kind of have I mean, he was in his 30s, and so he was kind of having his own experience. And so I really didn't have much support.

Um pretty much after the first race, and I talk about this in my book, he essentially like accused me of not like going after the race, even though I swam it in exact same way, and I was I balled my eyes out for like 3 hours. And that was day one. And so I kind of like at that point was like I'm going to compartmentalize this cuz I have 14 races to go, but like we're done. Like I you know, and so I end up leaving him and going over to Phelps's coach, Bob Bowman, um right when Michael decided to do his little bong stunt.

Um if you remember that in 2009, and so like nobody was their best selves. Like Bob was not his best, and Bob has admitted this since then. Michael was not. The TMZ was like all over the pool. And it just was like for everybody. I I think when I look back on 2009, I wish I had taken a beat, gone and seen a sports psych,

Yeah. and like worked through all of 2008. And it was just like, "Nope, like you got to keep going. You got to like It wasn't the times back then." I feel like now Now people would be like, "Yeah, maybe like go to on-site, or maybe like work through the insane emotions you just went through this 2008 year." And

Katie Hoff50:58

Yeah. And it was just like I wasn't talking to a sports psych. It was just like, "Yeah, you just got to push through, and you just kind of bury it and keep moving and compartmentalize." And while I think compartmentalizing is an incredible skill set, it's also a very damaging skill set. And so

Katie Hoff51:14

At some point. And so yeah, I really kind of went through a lot of like just I I'd have like a great world championships, and I'd win, and then I would kind of like It was just very up and down for me. And a lot of it was not physical. A lot of it was just mental of just I'm I would go around after that, and so much of my, which is such a cliché to say, but so much my identity was if I won, people gave me really great affirmation, and if I didn't, I was instantly like, "So no one even wants to speak to me.

Like why would anyone care about me if I'm not winning?" Um and that's I mean that stuck with me. Which it's such an interesting topic cuz people say like, oh well like your identity isn't directly correlated to your performances, but like it kind of is.

Katie Hoff52:08

100%

Katie Hoff53:08

Check the box.

Katie Hoff53:08

But but it like what I'm saying too is like the outside is saying that is saying the opposite. Like people's reaction to you is saying and is validating like your value is higher when you win. Because so it's it's like this like like I I even remember going to events even like what now with like there's influencers

Yeah. and like people who have like a ton of followers versus me cuz I didn't compete in 2021. But like it's such a battle to this day of like people are excited about winners. People are excited about X number of followers and so you have to be so strong and convicted in No, but like my my people who know me love me and it it it doesn't matter. But like I feel like it gets thrown around as like you're amazing without any of that. But yet society is is telling you the opposite.

So like battling that is like such a difficult thing and I think it's just an ongoing just like daily a conversation with yourself of like no like I I do have merit as just like being a good person Yeah. to people around me and being kind. But man, it is hard.

Katie Hoff55:12

Got a deal with like Speedo and TYR. Yeah, it's it I think like as I've you know, as we've gotten more into the social media and stuff and obviously I didn't compete during that time frame, it's such a difficult thing to look and be like Yeah, like why are people swarming that person when like my accomplishments are better than their accomplishments? But you're having to be like, "Okay, but yes, like they worked hard too." And like it's this constant I've had so many events I've gone to where I'm like It's okay.

It's okay, but yeah, it's just the world we live in and like you said like okay, I I sit there and I'm like, why do I care? Like why is this upsetting me? And then it's like getting the root like it's actually nothing to do with them. It's more your own internal crap that you need to go deal with.

Katie Hoff56:21

Thank you.

Katie Hoff56:21

It's just the reality of this world now, so.

Katie Hoff56:21

Yeah, I mean, so I essentially to cap off my career, I ended up not I got super sick of the trials in 2012, didn't make the team, which I always say is a blessing cuz it's how, you know, I was able to meet my now husband and and build a relationship with him.

Katie Hoff57:05

All over the map. Um yeah, I I was actually like building well like I went to 2011 worlds, swam well there um and went to 2012 in a different capacity. I was like God, I just want to go to my third Olympics and just enjoy it. Like you know, and um no, I ended up getting like really sick. Like I don't know if it was a stomach bug or what and ended up yeah, not making anything. And at that point I was like, okay, I must be a masochist.

Like I'm done. Like I am done. I I need to move on. And it was right around then that Todd and I had met. And he invited me to to come hang out with him at Michigan State. And that's how our relationship started of he reached out in a time where I always feel like people who have been through tough stuff understand how to talk to others in tough stuff. We had this conversation before where it didn't go well and so many people want to be like, "Well, it's okay.

Like we and I'm like, "No, it's not freaking okay." Like and so Todd all all he said to me was, "My thoughts and prayers are with you." with like a heart. And I was like, "Exactly." Like I don't need you to tell me it's okay. I don't need you to tell me I'm awesome cuz right now I don't feel any of those things. And he just got it. And we and he was going through a tough time, too, at that time once he got cut from the Rams.

And we just connected on that level of like, "Hey, I get you. You get me. I don't even need to say anything." And um at that point I was like, "Okay, I'm done." And I remember him looking at me like a year into it and he was like, "I don't think you're done." And I was like, "No, like I'm literally done. Like I hate swimming. Like at this point like I hated I hated everything about it." Um but I still had sponsorship stuff I had to do.

So I was still kind of in and out. Um and then basically to like skip ahead, I I decided to make this comeback and it was going so freaking well. Like I was swimming times in 2008. Like I was I was poised for this comeback for Rio. And life decided to to deal me another curveball and I got a pulmonary embolism. That's when I got the blood clot in my lung.

Katie Hoff58:37

So it started out essentially with just like uh I didn't realize it but I did have like a pain in my calf.

But like as an athlete, you know, like you're sore every day.

Katie Hoff59:10

So you didn't you just ignore it. And you're like, "All right. It's a normal daily occurrence." And so I ignored it. And then I flew from Miami where we were living to California. And then it moved to like I felt like kind of like a tightness in my chest, but again, I'm pre-nationals and like, whatever, that's weird, but and then escalated in 48 hours to like the still to this day the most pain I've ever experienced in my rib area where I actually passed out cuz I couldn't take in air.

Yeah. Um and so didn't got didn't know what it was. My poor I don't think he was he my fiance at that point. Like he had to make all these medical decisions for me of like whether to take me to the ER or whether to not. And we ended up not because if you if you don't have a TUE, which is an exemption, and you get an IV, like you're disqualified.

Katie Hoff1:00:05

And so him being an athlete too, like people were like, "What? You didn't take her to the ER?" I was like, "No, I love this man because he didn't take me to the ER." And so I essentially got misdiagnosed for eight weeks. They were like, "It's an intercostal strain. It's pneumonia.

Katie Hoff1:00:05

Yeah, well it Yeah, I'm like, "How did you think this was pneumonia?" And it's They didn't do a CAT scan essentially.

They waited for eight weeks to do a full-on CAT scan, which is what ultimately caught I had two blood clots in my right lung, and I flew with them. Like That's crazy.

Katie Hoff1:00:50

Correct. Or your brain.

Katie Hoff1:00:55

So yeah, I mean, and it it had already traveled from my calf to my lung. Like that's what I was feeling.

Katie Hoff1:01:02

Oh yeah, like it's like It's so crazy that I'm alive. And especially because I flew from California back to Miami, a six-hour flight. And so yeah, and I'm obviously at this point, those eight weeks, I was like, "I clearly I thought I was tough. I'm not tough." Because so many doctors were kind of like looking at me, they'd be like, "Resting heart rate 38. You seem young and healthy." and I'd be like, "Yeah, but like I can't breathe."

Yeah. And so, finally I I do a lot of advocacy work around this. I just I marched in there to my primary. I was like, "Something is wrong with me. You have to do a blood test. You have to do more tests. Like I'm going insane." And I remember being probably the only person to be pumped by someone to walk out of the CAT scan room and go, "You have two blood clots in your right lung." I'm like, "There's something Okay, like I'm not crazy. There's something wrong with me."

What do they do about that? They So, it's funny that they they could have it it current day, they have this like basically this device that can suck out the clots.

Katie Hoff1:02:05

Not any They didn't have it at the time. Um so, they essentially they're like, "We're going to put you on blood thinners."

Yeah. Coumadin? It was no, it was Xarelto, which was nice cuz you don't have to do any of the crazy monitoring. And that was kind of it, which was like such my my such my issue with they're good They've gotten better, but it was just like, "Go on take take the blood thinners. Yeah, and you can you probably can go back to normal after that." And I'm like, you know, not knowing that the scar tissue build up like in anything, right? You hurt your knee, you're going to have scar tissue.

I had scar tissue build up in my lungs for at least 3 years post the clots. Like I could feel it when I would try to take Really?

Breath in. And so, I essentially like tried to just get back to swimming on these blood thinners for a full year. Um cuz I was like I was so close Like I was so close. Like I was enjoying the process.

Yeah. I'm here in Miami with my fiance. Like this is amazing. Like I wanted I wanted to have Anderson on my cap instead of cough. Like there's so many like really cool things personally going on for me. And it was like I was so depressed. I was just cuz I I kept not being able to breathe. Like I just kept dying in practice cuz And um you know, my poor husband like was so supportive, but I was just like the worst version of myself. And I'm like, "This comeback is supposed to be about balance and enjoyment.

And like here I am like just awful to everybody around me." And so I ended up retiring in 2015. Um, and just kind of did the shove down thing for this little lady Hoffman of "Okay, like I'm just going to reinvent myself in the corporate world. I don't need swimming. I don't need anyone to know about my records or my medals. And I'm just I'm going to be happy that way."

Yeah. And chased that for probably six years. Like we moved to different companies. I picked up a lot of which not looking back, I have a lot of sales experience. I have a lot of ops experience. But it was just like I kept being confused of like I'm like the top producer in the company. Like why am I so depressed? Like why am I you know? And now looking back it's like, "You idiot. Like no wonder you're depressed." And finally when we moved here, it was always a reason, right?

It's like, "Oh, it's this city or it's this person." Or you can write it this. It's like or it's the job. Or like I always push it off on something external. And we got here to Nashville and we had an amazing community. And like I was really happy with what I was doing professionally. And I was still crying every day. And I was like, "What is hap Like what is going on?" And uh, our good friend Sara Blakely had um, basically gone to this Hoffman process.

And it was at the same time that Was it you? Was it you and Todd that were at the house?

Katie Hoff1:04:59

Is so like kismet the fact that like she came back and Todd was there. And she has this emotional release and Todd's like asking about it. And he was like, "Huh, like maybe maybe this is something that would help Katie." And so I remember him coming home and being like you need to call Sara. Like I think this is something that you're ready for cuz like I had done therapy but you're the same, right? I'm like an all-in like like I need to just like be immersed in it and and do it that way and so I didn't even look into Hoffman.

I called Sara. She told me that she like got her light back. I remember very specifically and I was like yeah, I don't have light. I am dull. Yeah. And I just signed up for it. And I was like

Katie Hoff1:05:49

Metaphor for it. And it's I mean it it's yeah, so I I went I signed up in February. I remember it was Super Bowl Sunday. And they didn't have an opening till July. Yeah. And so I remember feeling better cuz I just I felt this like this hope. I was like oh my god, there's something that could give me relief and joy and lightness and um I mean it was the hard I call I call Hoffman the most excruciatingly beautiful thing I've ever done. Yeah. Like the hardest 7 days, you're basically stripped down to like your soul and your deepest shames of your life and forced to confront them and and forced to understand them and they give you tools, but I remember FaceTiming Todd and he started crying when he just saw me cuz he was like your face looks so light and relaxed.

And it was kind of just the first time that I had addressed so much of the core of why I had had such trauma in my swimming career. Like I always blamed like oh, it's this record or this coach and it's like no, it's like from like deep childhood patterns.

Yeah. Like you know, it it was just this understanding of me throughout my life and I mean I recommend it to everybody I think or some form of it whether it's Hoffman or on-site, but it was a big unlock for me to kind of be able to move forward and I mean it's why I started the podcast. That's why I was able to go back to swimming that I left behind and um I I'm so happy I did it cuz it was life-changing.

Katie Hoff1:07:23

Like yeah, your knee's jammed up and you're kind of limping and you're like, "I'm going for surgery." Surgery sucks, the recovery sucks, but when it's fixed and it's 100% back then you're like, "Thank god I did that." That's how I think of that. It's like mental surgery. Yeah. No, it's it's so true and like while you're in it, you're like why there's so many moments where I'm like, "Why am I doing this?" You know, like this is I don't want to cuz you have to you have to show up each day and go all in just like a training session.

Like the people that you saw that kind of like were half in half out. It's like you may well as not come, you know.

Katie Hoff1:08:14

that." Yeah, and I feel like it I feel like it I mean I went to I went back to the Olympics in Paris for the first time in 16 years. Like I just never I always thought, "Okay, well like that was my life in the past and I had some good times. I had some bad times, but like I'm never going to get to go back to that and say

Katie Hoff1:08:42

100% 100%

Katie Hoff1:08:57

That I wish that I done. Yeah, and I think it was also there was so much shame around which is like so been counter contradicted as of late, is I thought that so many people didn't view me in a certain way. Like I didn't feel like people thought, oh this like girl like left her mark and is like a legend in the sport. And every, you know, conversation or podcast I have people being like, oh yeah, like I looked up to you or oh you were the And and I I like jump back cuz I'm like, really?

Katie Hoff1:09:26

And and I had all these narratives and beliefs about myself and they were all made up. Like it was all for me and had I not gone back in the sport, I would just I would believe that to this day.

Katie Hoff1:10:01

Yes, exactly.

Katie Hoff1:10:01

Yeah, and I also think it's too like the And I don't know if it's just like me or there's been a perspective shift, but like when I have now watched the Olympics and we talk about someone who's a legend who like they won a silver medal, people are like, oh my god, like you won a medal. And I'm like, oh wow, like is that how people view it?

Because like I always viewed it as like, oh like you didn't win gold, okay, like move along now. And I feel like now there's not even that question. It's just like someone finds out I won Olympic medals and they're over the moon about it or they I see them talk about somebody else and they're just like freaking out. And I'm like, has it shifted or is it have I shifted? I don't know.

Katie Hoff1:10:47

Yeah, Unfiltered Waters has been a blessing.

I think like anything people look at podcasts, you know, and they're like, "Oh, yeah, like what you just start it and you just talk on a mic and it's like there's so many layers

Katie Hoff1:11:21

Right. And it's like, you know, I'm I I said from the start I would never want to just start a podcast and have it be this just kind of like, uh, this thing I do. Like anything I do that's all in it's I want it to be the best.

I want it to be at the Olympics. And so, it's been a journey, but I think, you know, we were have worked with the USOPC. I I went out and did some stuff with the figure skaters for the Winter Olympics. Got a ton of great feedback.

Great. So fun. And so, I just I feel like it's kind of this full circle moment is like I felt like when I was swimming number one, there was not a female interviewer where I felt safe and vulnerable and like ability to kind of like spill my heart. And so, having an athlete like finish a conversation with me and I would say conversation instead of interview cuz it's truly a conversation and be like, oh, like that was so much fun. Like I was able to you know, like is like is my gold medal.

Like I just like, oh my god. Good, you know, that that's my whole goal. And so, I mean, my goal with it is to be able to impact as many viewers as possible, which is partnering with people like Team USA and and different prolific brands. And I mean, the LA Olympics is like in my mind like our our come out moment. And so, everything I'm doing, all the traveling I'm doing is around building towards really being able to make this massive splash not only in swimming, but in all Olympic sports in LA.

Katie Hoff1:12:54

Yeah, that's always fun cuz there's a part of me where I'm like, but like this is your Olympic. Should you Should I be wearing this jacket? But obviously once an Olympian always an Olympian, but I think yeah, it's just been so it's lit I always feel like people talk about you can't chase the high of the Olympics for the rest of your life.

Like same thing, you can't chase the Super Bowl if you're football play like there's there's never going to be anything that compares to it. And as soon as you get your head around that, the happier you'll be. But I feel like this is a parallel of it's not the same, but the feeling of finishing out like a week-long event and getting all these amazing conversations and getting ready to put them out is so cup-filling for me. Um that I never thought it could be. And it's just like one of those things that's just been a surprise.

You just have to keep trying stuff until it until it works. And um my hypothesis in all of this is like, well, I've been through the highest highs, the lowest lows. So like when you're talking to me, like I get you, you know? It's like what I felt like when I met when I met Todd, it was like I didn't have to like overexplain. I could just like bare my soul and there was just this mutual understanding of not only do I get you, but I'm also not I don't have an agenda.

I'm not trying to give you a gotcha moment. It's just like talk to me cuz I get it, you know? And I feel like that has been received really, really well from from really all sports.

Katie Hoff1:15:39

Like if I can watch an interview and I'm talking maybe 15% of the time, I'm like, "Hell yes." Because that means like I was able to ask a very succinct question that then prompted them to go deep and I think that's been my like when I watched I watched every podcast back, but it's not for enjoyment. It's cuz I'm sitting there being like, "That was a bad question." Oh, you know you know like I'm critiquing it, but it's in a very healthy way. It's like rewatching a race.

I'm like, "I want to be someone that is like, you know, like I look at Joe Rogan and some of these these podcasters that have been doing it for so long." And each rep is an opportunity to get better at the craft.

That's right. And so that's how I view it. It's it's a podcasting is a craft.

Yeah, oh for sure.

Katie Hoff1:16:17

Yeah, in 60 minutes with cameras on, you know? Like people don't realize like it's not easy and then, you know, you have the brand side and then you have the content side and there's just and I'm like I have my hands in all of it, but I wouldn't have it any other way.

Like I mean, the six bags that last year I went to NCAAs for the first time. I literally had six bags of equipment with me and I'm trying to like haul it through the airport and I'm like, that's what people are not seeing the behind the scenes, but I again like I'm just like you know, obviously I'm cursing at BNA like having it like fall down the street, but like it's so bad. But I'm like that's part of it. Like that's that's the journey to I also had to start at, you know, a lowly state meet when I was swimming to get to the Olympics.

So this is this is that grind and this is that period and I'm just embracing it.

Katie Hoff1:17:08

Keep grinding on the pod. We do have this app that we work with some teams across the nation called Synergy. So I've say I've taken more over that since Todd's doing his thing with Dream Recovery, but we have some travel, but yeah, I almost view it as it's such a hard mental thing.

I think with women is people are like, well, you got to get it all in before the baby. And then in my mind I'm like, but I can still like do I mean it's going to be more challenging, but I still want to do a lot of those things. So I think it's banking some episodes so I don't have to think about it, you know, for a little bit and then getting some visits into our team. So we'll be in New York and Austin and Jersey in the next couple months.

And then just I don't really have the nesting gene. Like everyone's like, are you nesting? I'm like, no. Like I want to have a great setup, but I think just yeah, feeling prepared and feeling like I'm in a great mental state low stress, which is like so difficult for me, but I think yeah, I'm just trying to kind of you know, cross all my T's so that I'm the best version of myself mentally for my daughter. Like that has been such a fun shift for me is like anything physical, supplements, sleep, it's all like, oh, this isn't about just me anymore and it's kind of a cool shift because it's always just been me and now suddenly it's like, oh well, I got a little bun in the oven that like needs me to not be a high strung crazy person all the time.

Katie Hoff1:18:47

He's working on it. I mean it's it's so funny. He was even saying the other day there was this like thing that could help with like the tongue like strength or something with it which is really helpful for sleep. So I feel like there's two things. I feel like people are one rooting for us to have really shitty sleep because every question at every event people are like, yeah, but like do you have kids?

So I feel like they're waiting for that and then also just kind of like what Todd comes up with in terms of ways to mitigate the bad sleep.

Katie Hoff1:19:17

I have no, but it's being worked on as we speak right now. Does it start with an H?

Katie Hoff1:19:46

Oh, great. Okay.

Katie Hoff1:20:38

Excited then.

Katie Hoff1:20:38

No, not yet, but it we're in the we're in the process of talking um and them working with the podcast, but yeah, I feel like that's like a Todd always says is like if you if you could only get two, three hours of sleep with the baby, like make sure that the best sleep

Yes. of your whole life and so that's what I'm hoping with with the Helix.

Oh, good. Yeah, that'd be great. Well, is there anything else that we didn't talk about that you want to talk about? Um no, I feel like we covered everything. I feel like we covered my story and I feel like I think the thing I love probably talking about the most, which is hopefully not like too much for people, is just like the mental side, like the Hoffman process and I think

Katie Hoff1:21:58

No one can do that for you. I mean, that's why I loved like you looked around like in 35 people at Hoffman. I mean, all walks of life, different stages of life, different ages, different I mean, it was like you had a guy who was like 72 years old that was bagging groceries at Whole Foods.

Yep. Dealing with some of the same shame that I you know, like it's just like it's humanity and so I think like that actually makes you feel kind of less isolated cuz you're like we're all in it together. It doesn't matter like where we are, we're all dealing with some of those same emotions, So, yeah, no, I could talk about that for hours, but Yeah, good.

Katie Hoff1:22:41

Yeah, it's going to be so fun. It'll be even nasal strips. There is lines around the building in Austin. So, I hope it's as fun