The Blast that Saved his Life

Mike Sarraille2:05

They they want it. You're You're 100% right. So, you've heard this name, Dr. Jonny Kim.

Mike Sarraille2:32

In and the highly decorated seal. You know, the thing that's interesting, I you have to imagine it would suck to be one of his kids.

Like, how do you live up to that? And so, I did ask them that on on a podcast. I said, "Hey, you know, I always measure myself against my old man."

Mike Sarraille2:49

That's just that that's inevitable. And uh he's like, "Here's what I'll tell you. I've told them this. I don't care if you want to become a a doctor, a lawyer, a pianist. All he asks of his children is pour in Yep.

To what you want to do and what your passion is. And that's that's powerful.

Mike Sarraille3:49

No kidding.

Mike Sarraille4:26

Yeah.

Mike Sarraille4:42

That's good. You've got to keep kids active. Yeah. And you know, you've got to try a lot of things to to to ultimately whittle down to what he what what his or her passion is.

Mike Sarraille4:54

I mean, I'm sure you were raised the same way. You know, my parents had us in pretty much every sport

You could think of. They put us in music, went through like five different instruments before they realized, okay, this isn't your thing.

But you've got to dabble. You've got to expose your kids to a lot. And even there, was it uh Federer? Yeah, I

I think there was a I'm trying to remember if it was Fed or a good article about his parents had him in a ton of sports until it was like 14, 15, 16 when they realized tennis was

Was his passion and was his his gift.

Mike Sarraille6:01

This is my dream come true. I was like this is the closest I'm ever going to get. Kim living my fantasy. That is awesome. That is awesome. So, where'd you grow up? Bay Area. So, my brother and sister were born in the city. Uh parents were born in the city. We our family has been in San Francisco since uh 1899.

Mike Sarraille6:20

Cops, fishermen, uh plumbers, electricians. Uh San Francisco in the Bay Area was a great place to grow grow up in the ' 80s, '90s.

Loved it.

Very different this these days. We don't I don't think we need to explain why but uh so I was born I was the youngest in Palo Alto California. So we grew up in the Powalto Stanford Menlo Park area and um eventually went to high school like my brother in San Jose which it was a Jesuit all boy school and and loved growing up there. I mean you had the you had the beach

Mike Sarraille6:52

You had the the mountains not too far away. It was about four hours to Lake Tahoe. We were always skiing so nice.

There was no shortage of things to do

Or trouble to uh to get into. done that.

Mike Sarraille7:04

So, my dad uh his dad was a cop in San Francisco, one of the lead detectives. That guy was a personality. My grandfather, they actually had a racehorse named after him.

Mike Sarraille7:13

Inspector Celli. It was not a winner.

Uh my mom, her father was a a fisherman. Yeah. Uh did that for her career. And then uh dad, you worked in uh juvenile hall.

Oh, really?

In the jails while he put himself through Santa Clara University. My mom became a nurse and my dad worked for Hyatt when Hyatt Hotels when Hyatt was based out of San Francisco.

Mike Sarraille7:36

So, we knew the Pritsker family really, really, really well. And when they made the decision to shift the headquarters to uh Chicago, my dad's like, I there's no way I can get my wife out of here. I mean,

Hundreds of cousins in uh in San Francisco. So, he started building uh businesses. He built a marketing and advertising uh agency. Did very well for himself and uh eventually sold that later in his life. My mom served for a nurse for more than uh 20 years. And just you know when I talk about my childhood like you you hear other stories I I was fortunate parents.

Yeah. I mean Roman Catholic they were strict. Uh they were loving and and just what any I think what any child would want.

Yeah. But they exposed us to a lot and they held very high standards both uh academically um and then even for same thing you know playing basketball was really good at basketball uh growing up uh good at soccer uh running and uh you know I'd always be looking in the stands at my dad every time you know I missed a like there was

There was pressure but that you know that pressure is necessary for kids they didn't do it in this this this

You know psychological way that caused me damage. Yeah,

But if they had not applied the pressure uh in my youth then I don't think I would have had the foundation that I had stepping into the military.

Mike Sarraille9:00

So false start as we uh we call it went to the University of Colorado Boulder for about a year. Um and uh that was not going to work out. Uh Boulder is a very fun town

And at the time there was this thing called the Gold Pass.

Mike Sarraille9:14

Where basically you had access to all the uh slopes.

Mike Sarraille9:19

I will always choose the outdoors over sitting in a uh a classroom. And uh I met a force recon marine just beast.

Mike Sarraille9:29

Uh cuz I was in the University of Colorado NOTC, Naval ROC unit, not on scholarship.

Um cuz my grades in high school were not great.

Mike Sarraille9:44

You can. So they'll cover your tuition. It's actually a great deal. So you don't have to go to the academy.

Mike Sarraille9:48

You can go to a a normal university, have a normal normal life. I I have a lot of respect for the guys that go to go tomies, but you're in it. Like you're in it all the time.

Mike Sarraille10:01

But what you And bro, I'll tell you this. The the guys and I knew a lot of I mean the SEAL teams was was dominated by academy graduates.

Uh they make up for lost time. Oh yeah.

When they finally get commissioned as officers and they're they're SEAL training, they're making up. there like which which was the craziest thing. So after a long day at BUD/S where you're exhausted and like the smart thing to do is go to sleep because you got to be up early. Some of those guys were going to the bars. I like I just don't know how they did it

Mike Sarraille10:30

Oh yeah. Oh yeah. I I remember one a guy named John in particular. I think he's still active. Great dude. That guy was catching up for lost time. But um while I was in there, you know, there was these probably about 20 active duty Marines, what they call Miseps. Yep.

They're trying to become officers.

Uh they're they're on active duty attending college. And one was just different. One, he was a force recon marine, which those guys are a bunch of badasses.

Just absolute physical beast. And he was nice to me. And he wasn't like the other Marines. Humbly confident. Didn't need to do the bark bark bark like most Marines do. Wasn't

Mike Sarraille11:06

Well, they had permanent staff there that were active. Okay.

And this guy uh basically took me under his wing. He's like, "A college uh probably isn't going to work out for you this go this this goround probably wouldn't worked out for me to to to the military." And uh that's why I enlisted become to become a recon marine.

Mike Sarraille11:27

Yes.

And And what's re what's Force Recon? Force Recon at the time uh 80s 90s up to 2006 was the Marine Corps's version of special operations,

But it did not belong to the United States Special Operations Command like the SEALs do and the Green Beretss do and PJs and CCTs do

Mike Sarraille11:48

Delta and Dev Group uh belong to something called JCO. is within the SOCOM umbrella, but that is a what we we refer to as our tier one forces and they're segregated from two

Uh there's three there there's a couple there's support commands as well that support what what dev group and and Delta do, but there's also something known as the uh 24 STS uh which is the air force component,

The par rescue men, the the combat controllers, the combat control. That's what I'm thinking. Total total studs with us on every mission, right? Oh, yeah. They bring this specialty. Not only are they shooters, but they bring this specialty. If it's the CCTS, they can set up uh airfields in the middle of nowhere. They can land on a highway and set up a airfield on a highway.

Mike Sarraille12:41

And they they they made the decision to uh to drop on the planes and just destroy them. Uh, and then you have PJs, which uh are the best at high angle recovery. If you fall down a mountain, like very few people can recover you like a a par rescueman. Got it. But they're also high-speed medics. If you were shot

Uh and time is, you know, blood is time and time is blood.

Uh you want those guys right there working on it because they're going to patch you up. They are like doctors in a combat setting.

Mike Sarraille13:10

So here's the funny thing and we were just talking about performance. So in the 80s there was a Marine Corps common known as Algare and the Marine Corps uh was given the opportunity to join SOCOM when it was being stood up in the in the 80s. And you know I'm paraphrasing his reply but it was basically uh there are no special Marines. Every Marine is a rifleman.

Mike Sarraille13:32

I vehemently disagree with that. Marines are a different breed. There is no service like the Marine Corps. I would not have succeeded like I did in the SEALs without the the foundation that the Marine Corps layered on top of what my parents built. But performance follows a bell curve and and the the force recon and the recon marines uh are are a different breed compared to other uh military occupational specialties within the Marines. And he missed out on a huge opportunity for the Marines to be part of SOCOM from the inception.

And eventually the Marine Corps recognized it. Uh and in 2005 they stood up a developmental group known as Mars debt one.

Mike Sarraille14:14

To prove that they should belong in SOCOM and they crushed it.

They they deployed along uh alongside SEAL team one uh under our special operations uh element out there. Uh and now they have Mars which are known as the Raiders which is a lineage from World War II.

Mike Sarraille14:32

Um and Mars is is crushing it. So Mars Raiders would be the same as like Navy Seals.

Mike Sarraille14:38

And Green Brays.

Mike Sarraille14:39

Okay. So when you you go to Marines, you go to boot camp. How was that? It was much needed in in when I enlisted, I knew I'm like, "Hey, there's something's got to change." Yeah. And uh Marine Corps boot camp is it's it's it's scary. The the everything about the drill instructors,

Which they say is one of the hardest schools to to pass in uh in the Marine Corps

Mike Sarraille15:03

To be a drill instructor. I mean, you look at them, just their appearance, their demeanor, their posture, their physical fitness, they were impressive. And I had a great group of of drill instructors, and while they're hard, they also care.

Mike Sarraille15:17

They they want to they want to produce the the future legacy of the Marine Corps. And so, they pour into you sometimes uh in a very harsh way.

Mike Sarraille17:24

Without a doubt. Without a doubt. Not everyone is starting from the the same starting starting class in uh in boot camp.

And that's what's phenomenal about it. I mean, they take guys who maybe played video games for the majority of their uh their high school career. Um and and they turn them into exceptional human beings. Nobody and I I think anyone in the Army, Navy, uh and Air Force would agree with this. Like Marine Corps boot camp is known as being the hardest. It's three months.

Yeah. and they have a a way of turning your average young man or woman into a total beast within 3 months changing the constitution of of that human being.

Mike Sarraille18:08

Absolutely. Absolutely. And and what's great about boot camp is uh well there's two boot camps. There's one in Paris Island. Basically, I think that the the premise is everyone east of the Mississippi

Goes to Paris Island. everyone west uh goes to uh San Diego. So I went to San Diego,

But I had people from Louisiana, Texas, Kentucky, uh it was like a melting pot.

Mike Sarraille18:31

Black, white, Chinese, Hispanic. Uh every every other race in between there. And that was a I think that was a shock for anyone cuz by by 18, 19, you probably haven't traveled that much. You haven't seen much in the United States. And I really appreciate the fact that I got to see all these different cultures thrown together, which could not be more different. And then they come out with a shared purpose.

Mike Sarraille18:56

A a shared discipline, a shared uh uh you know, accountability and just total loyalty to to the Marine Corps.

Mike Sarraille19:07

So the school of infantry uh and I I had had a recon guarantee guaranteed to try out. So when you when you went to the recruiter, you said, "I'm only signing up if you'll guarantee me a try out for recon."

So the the force recon marine help me with that. Recruiters can be uh sleazy.

Mike Sarraille19:26

Um

Like quotas to to to fill. So he made sure he's like, "Hey, he wants a a recon guarantee." But that just guarantees you to try out.

Mike Sarraille19:34

And

Mike Sarraille19:36

So recon is a divisional uh asset. Uh we are an asset for the division for their long range reconnaissance to support the infantry uh battalions. Uh force recon is a cut above and they are what you call a meth marine expeditionary force asset

And they can also do uh long range uh reconnaissance but they also have the jump capability call and then they can also conduct uh direct action missions. You've got a bad guy in the house, they they want, you know, to to go capture or kill that bad guy. Force recon does that. Okay. Or hostage rescue. Okay.

Mike Sarraille20:15

So they are and and you know what we say the W white soft side everyone other than Delta or or or uh Dev Group.

Mike Sarraille20:25

Uh really doesn't do hostage rescue. Even even Army SF units have something called the CIFFs.

Mike Sarraille20:32

Um

Are they capable? Yes. Is that going to be your primary tool? No. And I'm not like those guys are are are awesome. I'm not taking anything away from them.

Those two units specifically train for that mission and it it is it is precision and it is speed and very few can and can can can handle it. The difference between the tier one forces is uh

One you have to go through another selection process. So even after I became a SEAL you've got to go through another selection process and it's

It's the most psychological uh it's psychological warfare. It was it was the worst nine months of my life where you're questioning

Uh your your value and whether you're you're like every single day you're like am I going home today?

Um the average age at those units is actually pretty high. It's like 35. Yeah. And they can stay there uh almost their entire careers at the the tier one units because once you've spent that much money in that they have that corporate knowledge.

Mike Sarraille21:24

You you want to keep them there.

Yeah. Yeah. And the average age of your standard uh Green Beret ODA or SEAL team uh platoon is I think it's something like 21 to 23. So that shows you the difference.

Mike Sarraille21:43

I did not make it to Force Recon. I made it to First Recon Battalion. Okay.

Had I stayed the Marine Corps, I I would have uh tried out and I have no doubt I would have made it. Uh

Mike Sarraille21:52

First recon battalion.

Mike Sarraille21:56

So, you go through something called the basic reconnaissance course, which was physically uh demanding. Even the entrance test that that you take it just crushing. You you will love this given what you do. So, you start with the Marine Corps PFT, which is a three-mile run, and you're trying to like max out on everything.

And at that time, because I was a cross country track guy, uh I think I ran a 1545 on three mile.

Mike Sarraille22:21

Track,

Which No, no, no. open open road 1.5 miles out.

Mike Sarraille22:29

No, no, no. No boots. You're you're in you're in running shoes. And I used to wear the They weren't the waffle shoes. They they were the you know the the cross country shoes.

Mike Sarraille22:38

I I knew that piece and how to how to prepare for that. But then max pull-ups, you got to get over 20. Max push-ups. I forget what that is. Max hitups.

And then they have you run the obstacle course. Um which you've got to do the obstacle course twice in a certain time period. Uh then they're putting you through max burpees, max uh flutter kicks, things along those lines. Then after all that, you put on a rucks sack, which I think usually was like anywhere from 30 to 40 lbs. I can't remember. And you run 10 miles to the pool. The base pool.

Mike Sarraille23:08

Uh timed.

Mike Sarraille23:09

And then when you get to the base pool, you do a 500 meter side stroke,

You know, uh four time. Then you got to swim with this brick the full 50 m keeping it out of the water. Then you do 30 minutes of what they call uh water tread while they're sharking you.

So the instructors they they'll put you real tight. The group maybe sit there's 20 guys trying out. So you know you're you're trying to

Mike Sarraille23:33

But you're hitting people so that throws you off and um and then all of a sudden you'd be pulled under uh all the way to the bottom of the pool and they want to see if you you react. But then you've got a surface and you've got to maintain uh treading water for for 30 minutes. Some guys have difficulty with that. When that's all over, you run uh the 10 miles back and you're done. And I'll I'll be honest with you, the next day or next day or two.

Uh I couldn't walk, right? Yeah. No, I can imagine

Mike Sarraille24:20

Uh, for a couple years I got picked up for uh and then also became a scout sniper, which that's that school was probably the only school that I was closest to failing because

Mike Sarraille24:36

That's where most uh most Marines drop because you know the shooting they do such a great job of instructing you in the shooting. Most people pass in a class of 30. There's usually one or two that doesn't pass the uh the shooting phase and you're good at shooting that.

Mike Sarraille24:50

No, but that was the saving grace.

Mike Sarraille24:52

Cuz you don't have any bad habits

And they love that. And Marines, so you go in boot camp, you go through I can't remember it was 2 to 3 weeks of nothing but shooting on the range. So you're starting with instruction on proper position, breathing techniques, uh how to aim,

Uh every every you know capability of the rifle, assembling it, disassembling it, and dry shooting,

Which is boring, but that's how you reinforce skills. And so even then, like in boot camp qualified as a rifle expert, but the stocking phase, you've got a kid from the Bay Area who didn't spend much time traditionally in the mountains or outdoors. Um,

Mike Sarraille25:35

It came down to my last dock and you you're paired with a guy throughout your entire time unless that guy drops and then they paired you with somebody else.

Mike Sarraille25:44

Uh, usually you can you can say, "Hey, this is not for me." And voluntarily uh drop out. Uh, that's that's rare. I I've seen it happen.

Mike Sarraille25:52

Yeah. you they they they drop you because you can't meet the standards or or pass certain tests. But

Guy was from Montana, grew up hunting, I mean, by nature.

And he helped me get into my last position on uh on my last stock. Um and we dropped the overwhelming I think we went from like 30 down to like 12 by the end of that phase. So that that was interesting. But eventually uh you know I had a great platoon sergeant and and a platoon officer and they're like, "Hey man, we think you should put in for an officer package. Remember this is pre 911. No war's going on." They're like, "Hey, we're we're going to deploy uh and we're going to sit in the Gulf on a ship for for 6 months." And yeah, we'll get to do some things here and there for training, but

They're like, "Go because you're not going to be young. go knockout college on the Marine Corps dime on active duty. And so I submitted and uh went to they sent me to Texas A&M which California kid. Uh have you been to College Station?

Mike Sarraille26:59

Oh it was uh I'll tell you what. I'm coming from Pendleton let's say San Diego. Uh it it was a cow town and I remember calling my mom because I'm I'm mopey when I land there and I'm like I don't like it. She's like if you're calling to complain about getting a free education I suggest you call somebody else. And she's like you don't like it finish college as quickly as possible and get back to. So that's what I did. I finished in three years but the ward kicked off at that point.

And so I'd went to Marine OCS and uh because you have to go to officer candidate school quantico after your first uh year in college crushed it. Finished honor man out of what like the 200 in the class.

Mike Sarraille27:48

And here's here's my my approach or my methodology. Wherever I go, I'm always representing whatever part of or whatever organization I'm a part of. That's how I feel, too.

I I was a recon marine and I and I was going to dominate and I I want to say I dominate. I did extremely well. Finished honor man.

But that I finished Marine OCS in August of 2001.

Mike Sarraille28:12

Few days later, less than I think like 3 weeks later, 911 happens. And I call my my my old man, my dad, and I'm like, "Hey, listen. I'm I'm going to request to go back to first recon battalion because we're we're at war. And he said, hey, for whatever wisdom he had, he's like, I think this is going to be a very long war.

I know you were considering doing a lat transfer to become a SEAL. I would suggest you do that and uh stay the course. And maybe he thought the war would be over and his son wouldn't have to go.

Mike Sarraille28:43

Yeah. And uh well a lot of mismanagement that for uh

Mike Sarraille28:48

And and funny is it next week my my schedules are running loose in my head. Yeah I think I speak in Dallas Fort Worth to the World Affairs Council on Afghanistan and particularly the uh the withdrawal uh next week. Um

Mike Sarraille29:05

Yeah, we'll come back to that. So, I go back and notify the Marine Corps because I have a Marine colonel at uh at Texas&M.

Also had a major who I I love. The guy was a mentor, Rodri Rodriguez.

And I told him first and he's like, "Hey, man. I'd love to keep you in the Marine Corps, but go do what you're passionate about." And he's like, "This isn't going to go over well with the Colonel. You're going to take your lumps." But he said, "At the end of the day, the military is going to get their pound of flesh. So, you might as well do what you want while they're getting their

Mike Sarraille29:38

So I'm still a sergeant in the Marine Corps. I don't commission until I finish my college education, which is the stupidest requirement

In my opinion. Okay. I' I've got a a very

Different opinion on the value of of college. Okay?

I I don't think a college degree

Uh qualifies somebody to be an officer. There's plenty of high school educated guys who are enlisted

Who are some of the best leaders I still hold on a pedestal to this day

In World War II. You know, you saw battlefield commissions, things along those lines, and they were were exceptional officers.

Um, and you've already evaluated them. If you're going to make them officer, you've been watching them for years.

Mike Sarraille30:14

Every every single day. There's no longer behavioral interview to to become an officer if if you pull from your enlisted core.

Um, so I do the the LAT transfer. um get accepted into the SEALs. I had to go to a summer 3-week try out uh after my junior year.

Mike Sarraille30:33

Well, accepted into the Navy.

Mike Sarraille30:35

With the intent to become a SEAL. And so, they have this thing, they used to call it mini BUD/S.

Mike Sarraille30:41

And all the uh ROC kids and all the academy kids that want to uh and technically I follow under ROC uh that want a seal billet show up for two 3-week classes. different different classes. You only have to go to one

And everyone's competing for like 20 or 30 slots. So you got like a hundred officers that want to want to want to be seals.

And so that's a competition. And I'm going to tell you those hundred are absolute studs. You had a a wrestler from Boston College who was an absolute beast and is now a dentist. Um just water polo players, collegiate. Uh

Mike Sarraille31:19

Oh yeah. Yeah, they they do. Um, and they I can't remember it, but they have statistics on what sports have the highest pass rate.

Mike Sarraille31:32

Most of them are like 6'3, 6'5. So, the running though can be a bit of a challenge for him.

So, I get picked up. Uh, did extremely well there.

Mike Sarraille31:40

It it is you can't separate the uh the physical. It's absolutely physical. Everything about it is uh physical, but it's absolutely mental and psych psychological as well. So, I'd already been through that training.

I think I was a standout leader because, you know, when you're going through hell, the ability to pull guys together and say, "Hey, this is what we need to do. We need to get done now. Uh let's let's align. That's the direction. That's what success looks like." So maybe that that that played to the benefit regardless I was selected graduate from&M get uh discharged as a sergeant.

Mike Sarraille32:21

It was it was it served its purpose.

Mike Sarraille32:26

Cadets. No. No. What I did do was I served as an advisor and still keep up with some of these guys to core cadetses that wanted to become recon marines.

Mike Sarraille32:37

And loved it. And those kids were like sponges. So I take them to the pool, we do the sharking. There was a there was a force recon marine at uh&m alongside with me. Take them on. I take them out into the field, teach them land nav, teach them patrolling, things like that. So it was something to do while I was in college because, you know, I wasn't like your average uh college student. Uh make it through through BUD/S and it was it was physical. Uh made it through first first pass with my class.

Mike Sarraille33:03

So, you go through PTRR, which is one month of preparation training because some guys are not the best swimmers. So, PTR is they are uh they're pushing you hard, but they're also instructing you on techniques and things like that.

Uh then you go into phase one, which has hell week.

Mike Sarraille34:17

Oh, they hit you hard that first week of of phase one.

Mike Sarraille34:25

I I'd equivaled to shock and awe. Yeah. That that's that's what they're trying to do. The hardest part was that there was a war going on. So now they're not effing around. They're like making sure you can handle this. Like was it a level stepped up? You think in terms of seriousness?

Yes. I I think the gravity of the situation and what was on the the tail end of of making it through. I I think that that maybe reinforced uh everything and maybe accelerated or amped it up. But for me it was like I want to get this done with.

Mike Sarraille34:55

Yeah.

I've missed uh enough of the war. War started in 2001. It's now 2003. I'm like I want to get to the war. Got it.

I've been training for now, you know, five years uh by 2003. It took me six, seven years to finally get to to combat. Okay.

But I appreciate that like that that was a lot of preparation for for the first time stepping into a combat zone

Where a kid may have enlisted after 911, goes through boot camp, goes through infantry training, shows up to an infantry battalion, and that battalion's deploying two months later.

Yeah. Like that's I have nothing but respect for those young men that uh that did that or anyone else who who was on that fast track.

Mike Sarraille35:38

Yes.

Mike Sarraille35:42

Yes, they do.

Mike Sarraille35:46

So what is unique about BUD/S is Yes. Everyone knows everyone has a rank but you're going through it together. And usually everyone's on firstname basis. Not not with the instructors. not calling the instructors by Bob or or Mike.

And

Really, everyone is

They're trying to prove themselves. They're trying to prove themselves as a as a consmate teammate.

Mike Sarraille36:06

But you do have some some duties as as an officer, as a boat crew leader. Yeah.

You're being evaluated. So if you can create a a very cohesive aligned little boat crew, if if you can take uh you know very simple instructions and execute upon those instructions, if you can motivate and inspire your team to move faster, uh you're being evaluated as an officer in that regard,

But it doesn't mean the officers are the top performers. There there was a kid out of Louisiana

Who who grew up on a ranch that was like just an absolute uh beast.

Yeah. Um and in that in that I mean it it becomes a brotherhood.

Mike Sarraille36:43

Nobody cares about rank.

Rank matters but at the end of the day in the SEAL teams it's just it's a different community. We're all on firstname basis. Uh we know that hey ultimately if there's a platoon uh officer in charge that he's ultimately responsible uh whether the team fails or succeeds

That that exists just like any other military unit.

But they call it the teams. Yeah. For a reason. Much like the SF community, they sometimes ODA teams, so they refer to it as the the teams. Special operations is is just different. It's not your beltfed y

Uh version of maybe the conventional military.

Um and you have higher expectations. You have higher standards and there's a higher level of accountability.

Uh and and I enjoyed it. I enjoyed my time in in the recon community. I enjoyed my time in the SEALs. Uh went through a number of combat deployments in Iraq with SEAL team 3. uh absolutely love the guys I was with and then you find out that there's another element that uh is the 1% of the SEAL community.

Mike Sarraille37:52

So I had become a a combatant diver in the Marine Corps. I'd went through combat.

Mike Sarraille37:56

No, they didn't care. They they they Well, they had respect that I had previous experience.

Mike Sarraille38:06

You were evaluated just like the other students.

Mike Sarraille38:12

Uh the the dive stuff was I I felt the Marine Corps combatant dive course in Panama City, Florida, was harder than phase 2.

Okay. The academics were harder. uh the dive physics, the dive medicine, the even we we had a a comp week where they're coming down with where you're on a scuba tank.

Mike Sarraille38:32

They're bouncing your head or the manifold of the the scuba tanks against your head. They're bouncing your head against the uh the floor and those instructors were just

I'm not saying anything that they were using, but there was some uh

Some peptides being passed around that crew

Mike Sarraille39:01

Those those instructors were were massive and they'll tie your your scuba line up and you have to like work through the problems and some problems you can't work through where you just got to ditch your tanks and go to the surface um which it's intended but they want to see that you're calm under the water. That's open circuit. And then they move you to closed circuit, a rebreather.

Mike Sarraille39:19

Um, which is used in a tactical setting so that basically bubbles don't come.

Mike Sarraille39:30

In Marine Corps combatant dive course, I don't remember any. Even in uh BUD/S phase two, I don't remember any.

Mike Sarraille39:37

I So you have to do in phase one, you have to do a 50 yard 50 meter underwater swim. Yep.

And uh I passed out right when I touched the wall.

But revived real quick, came to real quick. But that that's very common.

Mike Sarraille39:52

Very common. And they're ready to rip that uh young man out of the water

And and basically just do the sternum rub until he comes or put him on his side, pat him back. Um I don't think they've ever had fatalities.

Got it. Got it.

Mike Sarraille40:07

Seal Team 3.

Mike Sarraille40:08

West Coast.

Mike Sarraille40:15

Yes. Not like, hey, I want to go to this SEAL team, but east coast, west coast, uh or Hawaii with something called SDVs. Yeah.

Which are the little man submarines? Uh which is a completely unique mission and I never touched that.

Mike Sarraille40:34

Yes. And and I we never understood why people would want to sign up for that. I think it's a it's a very unique individual.

Mike Sarraille40:49

Thanks but no thanks.

Mike Sarraille40:51

I'll pass. And and they weren't deploying to war the the same way that the SEAL team. They have a very unique mission

And it it's a a what we refer to as a national level mission.

Well, that's probably why they put them in Hawaii. It's like, hey, you got this [ __ ] job, but you get to live in Hawaii. And whenever somebody complains about living in Hawaii, they're like, "Oh, well, I got island fever." I'm like,

"You're you're not getting outdoors in that."

Mike Sarraille41:15

But yeah, show up to Seal Team 3, they were deployed when I showed up.

Mike Sarraille41:20

They were gone.

Mike Sarraille41:22

They were gone. So, there was a skeleton crew or or uh I I forget their term they use. Basically, a small crew that stays back to to take care of the families and admin and

Uh receive wounded coming back. Um

Mike Sarraille41:37

It's usually the guys that were injured that couldn't deploy, maybe tore an ACL, maybe had a spine surgery.

Mike Sarraille41:47

I'll tell you this. You're not walking in saying, "Hey, what's up, fellas?" You're you're like checking in. Yeah. You're you're uh

Mike Sarraille41:58

Uh they can make life difficult. The other officers can mess with you. The senior enlisted can mess with you. Um when you're an enen no like in this in in a lot of the military people just don't freaking care.

Mike Sarraille42:09

Uh especially if there's a guy who's an E6 or an E7 achieve. Yeah.

They're like, "Yeah, great.

You've got the knowledge base of basically an ant."

Mike Sarraille42:18

But they were deployed. So I joined them. Uh hit Baghdad in Ramani.

Mike Sarraille42:27

Okay. So

Mike Sarraille42:32

And they, you know, they stuck me in a limited role. I was, uh, basically the 50 cal gunner in the vehicle when they would go do raids. Uh, which allowed me just to watch.

Mike Sarraille42:41

And so I did appreciate that. And then when I got to Rammani, they were letting me in the train at the very back.

Mike Sarraille42:54

It's it's go time. Uh there's an element of nerves

Mike Sarraille43:01

An officer in charge of absolutely no one but but myself. Okay, that that's the truth.

And you're you're basically like, "Okay, just don't don't don't f up here. Don't be the guy that look at like don't don't have an accidental discharge with duty cow and and just cover down on on whatever you've been tasked with." And uh I enjoyed that part because I was uh just getting to learn how everything actually there's a separation between training and and you can only replicate so much and then real world operations. And so that gave me exposure even if it was a three-month deployment, but Rammani was uh contested.

Yeah. In 2005 when I was there.

And then I ended up going back in 2006 for what they refer to as the Battle of Ramati. And that was daily firefights alongside the Army and the Marine Corps. And that was, you know, the first exposure to the Marine Corps at war. And really my first exposure to to the Army who I cannot

Get this I was with in 2006 with the first of the 506. And that probably doesn't sound familiar, but the Band of Brothers, the HBO series.

Mike Sarraille44:08

That was that unit

Mike Sarraille44:09

From World War II.

Holy [ __ ] And one of the the the battalion commander of the first of the 506 was a guy named Ron Clark who's now a four-star general. Oh wow.

In charge of uh US Army Pacific, which is the largest uh component command.

Mike Sarraille44:23

Uh academy graduate, black guy. We used to joke he he needed to to get out of the army and become the uh the first black president. He was that

Just that inspirational, that that motivational.

Um one of the best leaders I I've ever worked for.

What do you think made him so good? you know, a lot of a a long list of attributes, no ego whatsoever, truly loved the guys. And and what I think people get wrong when we say when when you love your your boys, he wasn't going to shy away from holding them accountable and to a high standard.

Mike Sarraille45:02

And that's why I think standards and accountability are the highest form of love.

Mike Sarraille45:05

But he was he was just logical. He wasn't trying to to to to make a name for himself. He he wasn't even though he's a four-star general now.

He he wasn't, you know, jockeying for political control or or rank.

And his guys recognized that and you could tell he loved his soldiers. And when he lost a soldier, one of one of his soldiers was wounded.

Mike Sarraille45:26

Yeah.

You could see it in his his demeanor. He didn't take that lightly. Uh he had a great exo too, a guy named Dave Wac, who now is a major general.

Wow. um which that that usually doesn't happen. And we love these guys and we you know the thing that was unique is we treated their soldiers right down to the private and uh and we knew they sort of you know like oh damn seals.

Mike Sarraille45:47

We we treated them like human beings and we showed them the deepest respect because at the end of the day during that battle

How we were supporting them was through something called sniper overwatch. So we would go in before them at night, set up in buildings, set up our snipers so that when they came into the area,

We could provide uh standoff distance if any enemy combatants started to maneuver on them.

They were the ones fighting street to street and house to house

And that is the more risky mission. So we were supporting them throughout that entire uh that deployment which was six seven months and we built such a relationship with these guys that uh after that deployment and we we took our share of casualties. Um I I lost a guy on the very last mission who was awarded the Medal of Honor. He jumped on her grenade 3 ft from me and I

Mike Sarraille46:33

Uh we were supporting the first of the 506. We were actually due to deploy.

So we're we're closing down shop. were packing up and and

Mike Sarraille46:42

To head home and Ron Clark had say, "Hey, can you support us on one last mission?" The the answer was obvious like like hell yes, we can answer. And they were going into a district in Rammani that was highly contested. Um

In 2006, Al Qaeda had declared uh Rammani their caliphate, meaning their capital,

And they did own it. And um

So they went into the Malab district. We went in the night before, set up. We were down manning. We

Mike Sarraille47:18

The the truth is we're we're on night vision. We're we're walking in quietly. Not stalking in, but if you want to say stalking, but I I I get your meaning.

Mike Sarraille47:47

Well, there there was a way we we dealt with that. There was so many firefights going on that it was such like it was practice.

Mike Sarraille47:53

But even when we set in to to positions, we would like go onto the rooftop and their rooftops are all flat. It's not like America with with with uh our our roofs and they usually have these parapit or walls around the entire roof.

And so those are great for cover. And so we'd put a little C4 charge on the wall and blow this loophole for which snipers could shoot through.

And what we would do is we would set up uh diversionary operations. So we we'd ask the first of the 506, hey, can you send your Bradleys in this neighborhood? maybe fire off a few rounds into the ether and then uh uh maybe you know just make make some noise as those rounds as our explosives were going off. So people don't know where everything's coming.

Mike Sarraille48:31

And so the first of the 506 was due to come in at uh what we call beginning morning nautical twilight.

Mike Sarraille48:38

6 a.m. when the sun's coming.

So they they they can utilize some cover of darkness on the insertion or infiltration into the area.

And then they started hitting house after house. And we had gotten some firefights and I think by like 10 or 11 a.m. the first of the 506 had pulled out. Our logic was to keep the snipers in place because also we know the enemy comes back in. We can clean house.

Mike Sarraille49:00

And that we would pull out that night under the cover of darkness again.

Mike Sarraille49:06

And it's September. Uh I think the heat index ranged from 110 to 115.

Mike Sarraille49:14

Yeah. Well, you you would set up like you grab sheets from the house that you took over and try to set up these little shade. Uh but

Mike Sarraille49:23

You bring in like seven liters a bottle. Even if you have seven lers of of water.

Mike Sarraille49:29

You you still can't stay ahead of your hydration. You know those best, especially for what you've done.

Mike Sarraille49:40

That's insane.

Mike Sarraille49:59

Well, did you ever do the Badlands?

Mike Sarraille50:02

But even with the the Mongolia desert, I mean, you you had to have lost what 15 20 pounds?

Mike Sarraille50:38

"Not not a very good medical professional."

Mike Sarraille50:50

Yes.

Mike Sarraille50:54

You know, that's interesting. Guys, for even if they serve a full 20, 30 year careers were always tinkering with their gear cuz we had the same problem. You carry a pack long enough, it's it's cutting into your skin.

Mike Sarraille51:34

Yes.

Mike Sarraille51:51

Oh yeah. And you know again you tinker with that so that the pack is riding as high up

On your uh your back. Yeah. Yeah. You learn those things along the uh the way you but you've got to feel pain.

Mike Sarraille52:04

Is an interesting motivator to

Mike Sarraille52:25

I think the biggest misconception that people look at you like an elite athlete or or even the guys we served with, even pro athletes, you know, in basketball or football, they're all playing injured

Mike Sarraille53:00

While while they focus on optimal health, they're always stepping onto the field.

Mike Sarraille53:30

Competition makes the world go around.

Mike Sarraille53:36

Yes. Um, it was on the first deployment in 2005. Uh we were on our base. We got attacked uh and basically didn't have a target. Couldn't see the enemy, but fired in the general direction that all the older guys were

Mike Sarraille53:53

Mortars uh machine gun fire.

Mike Sarraille53:58

They get to the rooftops and uh all I remember is again firing in the same general direction as the older guys. um, can't see the enemy. And I felt like I'm like I' I've finally arrived, like I'm a god. It was it was the I'll use it was like the gayest moment uh for for a young man. Uh,

Mike Sarraille54:21

But that that quickly changed on on the next uh deployment.

Mike Sarraille54:35

For the first of the 506, the band of brothers. Um and uh they pull out again 10 or 11 a.m.

And a good piece of information is we'd sent so a SEAL platoon is like 18 guys, maybe it varies from 16 to 20. And we had sent like eight of our guys away to the other side of Ramadi to start palletizing our gear to redeploy home.

Mike Sarraille54:57

Which is which is an exercise in itself.

Yeah. And so we we made a decision to go out with only four SEALs with eight Iraqi scouts uh and four SEALs and eight Iraqi scouts into two mutually supporting sniper overwatch positions. And we say mutually supporting is

They're like 600 m away, but we could see their position and they can shoot maybe there's a guy

At the wall of the house that we're at and we can't see from the roof, but their snipers can reach out and we can do the same for there. So it's we support one another.

Mike Sarraille55:32

Uh so yes, 12 on our roof, 12 on their roof. And so

Mike Sarraille55:40

We had built such a good relationship with those guys. That said, there's always like there's always an element of mistrust as Ala coming that guy's family and hostage like if you don't kill Americans.

That was always top of mind.

Yeah. Uh but we had built a really close relationship with these uh we because we had trained him over months.

Mike Sarraille56:05

It's like put putting hubcaps on a uh a Ferrari.

Mike Sarraille56:09

Is what we used to refer to it as.

It was the mission because eventually we didn't want to stay there forever. We had to get their people competent enough to where they can maintain their security. I I don't think we uh achieved that mission

Mike Sarraille56:26

Well, and and I get it. Like ISIS was going to win,

Mike Sarraille56:29

And they they were not there was no cohesion amongst that nation that they were going to hold. Um but uh so the the the first of the 506 pulls out, we we stick around. We had had a few engagements uh snipers engaging uh combatants on on the the the ground on the street level.

Mike Sarraille57:00

You there there's a term called relative superiority. Yeah.

And that diminishes the more you stay in a static position.

And essentially they can triangulate based off their dead guys. Like, okay, he was shot right there, so the only only way he could have been shot was from that direction, this guy. So, it's got to be And so, they basically start to triangulate on your on your position. And they were doing that. I I was nervous the whole time, you know, as the officer in charge of that rooftop. Um I'm always just sort of going through my checklist.

Mike Sarraille57:30

And we had, this is 7 months into into this deployment, last mission. We we had become good at what we did. I mean, we even jumped on the rooftops that were adjacent to to our building and we would put like chain padlocks on the door so that nobody could access those rooftops.

So, and you had to learn these things along the way. I mean high performance is not about winning in the moment. Yeah, that matters but it's about evolving, adapting and learning from your mistakes and optimal performance over, you know, sustained periods of times.

And uh it was a big mistake to think that we could go out at half manning rather having eight seals per rooftop and than four.

And that's a mistake I'll I'll never let go and I still dwell on that. So, uh, Mikey, who's our youngest SEAL, Southern California kid, like 61, 6'2, 215, like good-looking kid, man. Um, he uh was a machine gunner. Uh, and so he jumped on somebody's sniper rifle cuz that guy Doug needed to get some rest. Yeah.

And so Doug, you know,

Mikey's against a wall and the sniper rifle behind the wall. He's got cover. He's looking through the loophole. Doug's 3T to his left and I'm 3 feet to uh to his right and I'm staying awake. I haven't slept yet. It's been now close to what you you've got the planning and preparation which you're not sleeping

And uh as an officer I got to do all these powerpoints to get the mission approved.

I'm tired and I'm having a conversation with Mikey. talking about going home and I'm starting to to nod

Mike Sarraille59:06

In what was a long nod all of the sudden I'm I'm awoken to uh Mikey standing up very abruptly and uh his chair that he was sitting in just a plastic you know chair goes flying back

It had come and hit him on the chest and uh and this I mean it's a tall building dominant building and had landed right in front of him. A hand grenade. Hand grenade. And uh he just looked at my direction, yelled grenade, and without hesitation like went right down on it. And uh when it when it went off, because he had covered it, it funnelized the shrap metal uh to his left and to his right. Yeah. And so Doug had like 30 holes. I had 30 holes uh in mostly predominantly the legs.

Now, had Mikey not jumped on it, Doug and I would have un undoubtedly perished.

Mike Sarraille1:00:06

We do.

Mike Sarraille1:00:08

He did.

Mike Sarraille1:00:12

So, with that heat, we we had taken those off.

Oh,

Are you supposed to?

Mike Sarraille1:00:21

No. The reality is guys take it off just like they take off their helmets. Should you wear your helmets 247 on a battlefield?

Mike Sarraille1:00:48

Yeah. Well, given the the the distance that had to be thrown, you you've got a very short period of time.

Mike Sarraille1:01:01

So there is no more selfless

Mike Sarraille1:01:05

There's no more intimate act. And and I say it was both the best and worst day of my life.

Mike Sarraille1:01:13

Best in that very few humans get to see something as intimate and as selfless and as loving as as his final act. and worst in that we lost Mikey and I had a list of mistakes that I made in the planning, the preparation, and I continue to go through my head.

Uh even though it's been 20 years, we're celebrating his uh

20th uh anniversary this September 29th. Uh

He was posumously awarded the Medal of Honor. Um there's a a very high-tech destroyer named in his namesake.

Mike Sarraille1:01:56

The USS Michael Monsoor. They're holding the ceremony on the 29th. Um

And working with Fox Nation as you as you know I do. Uh they're releasing a documentary called uh Man of Honor, the Michael Monsoor story.

Um and I was interviewed in that alongside Doug, a guy named Benny. the three of us were on the rooftop and then a few other uh platoon mates and then uh Mikey's sister.

Mike Sarraille1:02:28

So Doug and I and Mikey are extracted and Doug and I went into immediate surgeries in a place called Alicate.

Oh, that's right. Cuz you're injured, too. Yeah. Like how bad are you injured? So, after the grenade went off, we started to get hit with machine gun fire and RPGs and uh you know what we you can only assume is that they were going to try to rush the building and

Capture kill some Americans and get it on video.

So, we we were still in a firefight. Uh, I'll put it to you this way. When I I got turned by the grenade uh away from Mikey and just felt instant fire in my legs throughout my legs. Just excruciating pain. Just like peppered all through your legs.

All All through my legs. Still have a ball bearing on my my right side here.

I'd have you feel it, but that'd be a little weird in this setting. Uh, so I look back in Mikey's direction and yell Mikey three times and he's looking in my direction, eyes open, just no response.

Mike Sarraille1:03:35

And my my heart just melts.

Mike Sarraille1:03:38

Uh, you can train for this type of scenario, but uh you don't feel the the emotional spiritual like my heart was was ripped out.

Yeah, I can imagine. But I still have two other guys who who are alive. Um, Doug is injured and Benny's pulling Mikey away from the the the roof uh wall. And uh I I haven't I can't even look at my legs cuz I don't know if if my I'm like are my legs there? I don't know. This is just painful.

And my radio had been shut off by the concussion of the grenade, which is a fail safe of the the embitter. And so I go to call the other rooftop to tell them, "Hey, we're hit bad. We we're we're combat ineffective. Three of the four SEALs uh are are combat ineffective. Uh I can't even stand, nor can Doug." And the few Iraqis that we had on the roof ran off the roof and into the safety of the house.

Come on. One one who actually spoke perfect English um was in the fetal position. He saw what happened. He he he loved Mikey and he he loved the rest of us and he just sort of

Mike Sarraille1:04:56

Froze froze up. And so I know he had these Motorololis and that the Iraqi scouts in that rooftop had uh Motorolas. And so I just sort of put my head on the uh the ground, took a breath and sort of push up to run towards him to get his Motorola because he was far enough away that I had to move a distance to get to him. and I go face first into the uh into the uh the the rooftop uh because my legs just wouldn't work.

And so I finally had the courage to look at my legs and they're just a bloody mess. And

Mike Sarraille1:05:28

Uh pants pants aren't necessarily shredded. There's holes in the pants. The blood that was was coming out. They were they were bloodied.

So I crawled to him, grabbed the radio and on the Motorola call over to the other rooftop. Hey, put put certain guys names on the radio. Hey, we're hit. Mikey's Mikey's injured bad. Doug's injured. I'm injured. Um, we need we need you guys to collapse and move to our position now. And and that seemed like it took forever. Maybe five minutes, maybe 10 minutes because they've got to pack up their gear. Uh,

Mike Sarraille1:05:55

So they're under firefight in the street. And so, uh, we're we're, you know, the Iraqis are finally coming back onto the rooftop, and I'm instructing them to fire, fire, like, you know, like suppress a fire. And the guys eventually get to the rooftop. Um,

The army had already launched uh, Bradley fighting vehicles

To the street behind us. Not the street uh, where everything was happening, but a street behind the house. And so as the guys come up, uh, two guys pick me up, you know, carrying me like this because they need me to guide them to to where we got to the back end of the street.

Um, and so I guide them through the house, uh, in pain. They throw me in the, uh, the Bradley. They throw Doug in in the Bradley and then a good friend Jimmy who just physical physical freak had picked up Mikey 215 pounds. Jimmy's probably like 85, probably like this guy's like one of those guys that's like 8% body fat just but like yeah muscular

And you can see the exhaustion in Jimmy's face and Jimmy places uh Mikey in the Bradley and he sits into the Bradley with us. So now what's that? That's four of us driven to to get us to a a first aid station.

Yeah. And uh the whole time we had one we redeployed our medic who who signed for all the morphine. Yeah. So we didn't have any morphine. So you're just in pain for it took us about 40 minutes to get to a first aid station.

But Jimmy was so exhausted when he sat down in the Bradley. You could just see this sort of demoralized exhausted uh guy. And um I I remember him and I talked about it and we laughed about it. I'm like, "Hey, CPR." And he sort of snapped you and started doing CPR on uh on Mikey. uh finally got more famed when we got to the uh the aid station. The all of the first of the 506 had mobilized and were there to receive us. Think about like almost like a parade where they're lined up for the Bradley's to come in.

They're unloading us. You got Ron Clark who's there. You've got Dave Wac

Uh with their hands on us as as we're getting pushed into the aid station. I mean, that's the the the love between between brothers and uh they need to get us to a surgical unit. And um so they prep us, they give us morphine, they bandage us up as uh best as possible. And so we're in the sun when they bring us out on stretchers, Doug, myself, and then Mikey's body is on the stretcher. He's going to travel with us. Um, and he's he's been declared uh deceased uh by this point.

Um, Dave Wac has these, you know, this I think the the Oakley is in the mid 2000s and he comes and he puts them on me cuz I'm sitting straight up staring at this

And you could see it in his face and you can see it in Ron Clark's face. Um, they felt responsible um just cuz they were great leaders.

Yeah. And then they boarded us on a uh CH46, a Chinook, and fly us to TQ. And they gave us uh about 10 minutes. Mikey's body was in a room. So they carried Doug in and put Doug and I on Mikey's side to spend time 10 minutes with Mikey to to to say goodbye, which I'm still conflicted about because it was

You're looking at the thing you're responsible for. So there was that that that element of it. But uh then it was a a whirlwind of uh surgeries and TQ surgery in a place called uh I think it was Bad and then from Bad to Germany, another surgery a few days in Germany and then we made it back for for Mikey's uh funeral which

Part of me wishes cuz I just didn't want to face the family. Yeah. Um

And uh we made it back in time. We met the family and you know why Mikey, you brought up the selfless act when you meet Mikey's family. It was like the aha moment. You're like, "Oh, this is why he is who he is." Uh Roman Catholic family. Monsoor is a is a Lebanese Yeah. uh name. So Lebanese Roman Catholic. Um father served in Vietnam. His older brother was a Marine. His younger brother ended up joining the Marines after Mikey was killed. Um, and so they get me into a wheelchair after, you know, uh, when we arrive at the funeral.

And, uh, you know, I'm sort of rehearsing what I'm going to say to the family. And, uh, wasn't expecting it. The second they get Doug and I out of the vehicles into the wheelchair, uh, somebody comes in, whispers, "Hey, this is, uh, Sally Monsoor. This is Mikey's mom." And I wasn't expecting it to be that quick. Um, and she just comes up and hugs me and says, "I'm so glad you're okay and that you're home with your family." Not, "What happened? What happened on the rooftop?

Why didn't you bring my son home?" Her first response was, "I'm glad you're okay and that you're home with your family."

And whatever I had rehearsed went right out the uh door because I'm just like I I you couldn't speak after that. I just Thank you, ma'am.

Mike Sarraille1:11:14

So, uh substantial nerve damage in my uh right leg. Uh still can't feel my two uh pinky toes in my my right leg.

Mike Sarraille1:11:23

Uh they were excruciating for a while. Had uh strap metal in the bottom of my feet. Um

Mike Sarraille1:11:33

So, which makes no sense from the direction because my feet were facing this direction. The grenade went off here. I

However pattern whatever you know route the the frag takes but I had

Large divots in my legs which every morning for like 6 months I had to go and they would debris them but that's the level of care that like special operations was was getting

So I had this Texas A&M doctor uh tiny little gal I called her Dr. pain because they would debreed. So what were golf ball size holes would heal all the way out and be flush with my norm normal skin.

Um some scrap metal remained in. Um and uh then it was just a recovery over those 6 months. eventually like started walking, started uh jogging, started uh running as as that that's happening cuz I'm trying to get back to my SEAL team who's going to deploy in 2008 and I want to be with them and I'm I'm pissed.

Mike Sarraille1:12:32

I'm pissed. I was I was not a pleasure to be around.

I feel for my ex-wife and my my uh my oldest daughter who was two at the time.

Like probably not uh enjoyable to be around cuz all I wanted was to go back down range.

Yeah. and and get vengeance for for what had happened

For what

I'm I ultimately I made many mistakes.

Um

Mike Sarraille1:12:58

The morphine was good until they cut you off. Um

Mike Sarraille1:13:03

And then I can't remember what pills they had me on when they finally released me. I'm sure there was there was Vicodin or whatever whatever the the thing was at the time. Yeah.

Um but they wean you off that and then you just replace it with uh this thing called Jack Daniels.

Mike Sarraille1:13:20

And and got relatively I would say pretty out of shape.

Mike Sarraille1:13:23

Uh during that period,

Mike Sarraille1:13:25

Yeah. Um

Mike Sarraille1:13:28

Uh just a few weeks.

Mike Sarraille1:13:30

And then it was crutches and then it was walking. So

Uh very lucky the I was very lucky with my wounds because of what Mikey did.

And what about Doug? almost mere wounds to the legs.

Mike Sarraille1:13:43

Doug was only unique in the sense that he he had the legs, but he also uh broke his arm from one of the uh strap metal. So, he in his right arm he had some shrap metal,

But Doug's okay to this day doing uh great stuff. Um

Benny had to stay back in country and and and clean up and so I couldn't imagine how hard that was on him. Um, but Benny, Doug, and I have have reconnected of late, especially for this documentary, Man of Honor

On Mikey. Um, and everyone's doing well.

And, uh, I think there's a sense of healing when when we're together.

Mike Sarraille1:14:21

Cuz of course we're going to talk about it.

Of course. And you know, some other guys who've been in a lot of combat and lost guys, you know, somebody put it to me best. Guy who was who was lethal, just an absolute beast. Like no better friend, no worse freaking enemy.

Um, and I mean, he said it this way and he's like, Mike, at some point you just got to realize it's just war.

Mike Sarraille1:14:46

It's just war. And you can't like there's three rules for war. Rule number one, young men die. M

Rule number two, you can't change. Rule number one

And three, somebody must always walk point.

Mike Sarraille1:14:59

And uh I found that

To be helpful. Not that I'm going to put it down. Like Mikey's like a rucks sack. I've said this before. Like fused to my back.

Mike Sarraille1:15:10

People are like, "Well, you need to put that down at some point." And I'm I've said this before.

Mike Sarraille1:15:15

Yeah. like he's my he is as well as the other guys we've lost are are the reason I won't stop moving and you know they're like well that weight will get crushing though the legs get stronger.

Mike Sarraille1:15:37

No. No, no, no. It it it was recoverable. Um, and and in the grand scheme of things, guys have lost legs and some guys have returned to to active duty. Uh, the funny thing was when I got back to the SEAL team, I understand the logic. They'd be like, "Hey, we'll we'll send Mike with the platoon going to the Philippines." Yeah. On the next deployment.

And in in the Master Chiefs, the command master chief's office, they have name little name magnets.

Mike Sarraille1:16:07

On this whiteboard.

Yeah. And uh again, not enjoyable to be around. I went right into that that command master chief's office.

Mike Sarraille1:16:15

Took my name from the Philippines platoon, took some new junior officer who was in my old platoon and switched the name tapes.

Mike Sarraille1:16:25

And that's literally then went up to that platoon like, "Hey, you're supposed to report into uh whatever like Fox platoon." And that guy, of course, he's new officer's like, "Okay." And and that's literally I'm not joking. That's literally how I made sure I went back to uh to Iraq on the next deployment and thankful because uh I ended up in the Battle of Solder City. So that was

Mike Sarraille1:16:50

Yeah. Yes. And and the nerves were different going uh into that deployment cuz now I'd been injured and I felt what that feels like and that

That hurts.

Yeah.

Mike Sarraille1:17:02

It was against the Iranians.

Okay. So, uh, there's a place called Solder City in Baghdad and, uh, it's run by a guy named Makta Al Solder. He's the Shia cleric.

Uh, he's backed by Iran. So, within his militia, the Solder militia, um, they have Iranian special force groups.

Mike Sarraille1:17:22

That basically will lead, will train material support. And, uh, our first mission that that uh, in into Solder City was a complete abomination. really how nobody was injured, nobody uh was killed by the grace of of God. Um but it was a wakeup call that it was a different fight, a different enemy. They were much better than al-Qaeda, much better trained, um much better supplied

Mike Sarraille1:17:48

Weapons tactics. Um, so couldn't be prouder of the guys. Made quick adaptations, quick uh changes to how we operated uh after that first night from mainly the only casualty that that night was our our pride.

Mike Sarraille1:18:04

And we looked in the mirror and we're like, we have nobody else to blame, not the enemy.

Mike Sarraille1:18:08

Like that that's all us.

And so the guys made changes within 48 hours and then they went back in and absolutely crushed it. And it was it was kinetic for about three to four weeks straight like straight combat. Uh doing the same mission, Sniper Overwatch, and could not be more proud of the boys.

Mike Sarraille1:18:25

Uh our snipers were cleaning house.

Okay. like to the point where the army was doing a specific mission to basically build a T- wall barrier construction process way project while getting shot at and our snipers were were basically trying to keep them far enough away to provide support uh recover and concealment for uh for the uh the army and uh great 10th Mountain uh division uh had great relationships with them and uh it was a fun deployment. It was a kinetic uh deployment and I'd already submitted a package to be accepted to try out for dev groupoup.

Mike Sarraille1:19:03

Uh you say I want to go for the next level up. There's a package you've you've got to fill out. It's a lengthy package. Uh

Mike Sarraille1:19:11

Paperwork, but there's a lot of it's almost like a college.

Mike Sarraille1:19:16

Yep. You're filling out a lot of things. your motivation. Why? Um it takes you probably a good six hours to fill out that package.

Um and then they'll they'll come out to the West Coast and they'll do the same thing for the East Coast SEAL teams and basically screen you for a week. It's a it's a pre-screen to the major uh selection that consist of

Physical psychological uh sand table drills uh where you're basically planning a mission to to so they they can see your thought process your level of experience uh whether you you you you uh error with simplicity or if you try to over complicate. Yeah.

Um you're going in front of boards what we call murder boards. It's it's a long week. a lot of psychological assessments. I mean, they bring psychologists out, but it it was it was it was a fun experience because they're also at the end of like the sand tables. Uh you've got like the best of the best like, "Hey, let me give you some some pointers. Uh hey, you plan the mission this way. Here's a suggestion. You over complicated this this process, and I'm going to tell you there's going to be a lot of things that go wrong uh during that phase, the way you planned it." And so, they're they're they're coaching and mentoring and teaching you

Mike Sarraille1:20:24

Yeah.

Mike Sarraille1:20:28

Well, no, no. At the end of the day, we're all SEALs. They So, I mean, you're talking about guys with 10, 15, 20 combat deployments under their belt where like you just don't get those numbers

At uh at the the other SEAL teams.

Mike Sarraille1:20:41

And you're listening, you're like, "Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Uh-huh." And so, it was I I found him to be totally professional. What was interesting is the psychologist who who had been at that command for a long time when I went in front of the murder board, they didn't ask a question about Mikey Monsoor.

Really by design and the psychologist pulled me aside and said, "None of us need to bring up that day for you."

Mike Sarraille1:21:05

And I was shocked that I thought they were going to ask some hard questions. Um but they're putting you through scenarios like what would you do in this scenario? They're again they're trying to assess uh your logic, your critical thinking and then if you if if you pass that you you get accepted and then you got to go to what was a seven no no 8 nmonth uh selection process where you're you're you're under evaluation the entire uh time and I I'm always cautious about what that that process involves.

Mike Sarraille1:21:46

Different different. And here's how I'll explain it. Uh, the fear of, you know, getting maimed or or killed in combat. But your pride, you don't want to you don't want to have to go back to the

Mike Sarraille1:22:05

Like it's that that could be a defining moment for some people if they they fail and most do. Um but you're you're banking so much on this being your next move. And and for the guys that fail, I I I have no doubt they go through a process of feeling lesser than.

Mike Sarraille1:22:24

Uh very small.

Mike Sarraille1:22:24

Not many. Okay. A handful. Um, and uh, again, professional. Absolutely professional. I mean, wearing heart rate monitors the entire time to see where you're spiking. Uh, if you can can control your your your heart rate or or that you're not freaking out. Uh, they've got psychologists watching you. You've got the instructors who are from that command who are nothing but the most impressive individuals you you'll ever meet. and they're just layering something new on every day.

So, you've got to remember everything that you learned in the previous days and then they'll layer something new and something new and something new and something new and just constantly being evaluated. Um, and guys are going home every single day and sometimes it's guys from from the SEL teams that you're like, "Dude, that guy was like impressive at that team

And now he's going home." Like that naturally seeps into your psyche of like, "Oh [ __ ] do do I have what it takes?" Uh so it is it is physical not like BUD/S. You've already proven that. Uh but without training there's no way to separate the physical from from what you're doing. But it is it is psychological. And what basically the best way to put it is they are going to make things so ambiguous um so volatile and chaotic and give you limited information. And you've got to have a system where you can take limited information, create a solution to whatever problem set you're dealing with, and then execute upon that plan and the ability to adapt if that plan hits major friction from the start.

Mike Sarraille1:24:16

Blown away by how fast DEVGRU is moving compared to like a traditional team. Yes. That's that's the part where most people drop because they're layering

On top of

Mike Sarraille1:24:31

Yeah. I mean, they start like square one just clearing like one room with a pistol and then it's moving from one room with a pistol to now a rifle

Uh with multiple targets and now with barricades and now now you're moving to a door into a second room. and it just think like a large building and then all of a sudden the whole building's in play and they're watching you from the rafters and even the smallest thing your your step work is off um you know the target uh P um you've got P a target and sometimes the targets same targets will have a pistol

But the next time it will have a cell phone

And because things are moving so fast you just couldn't keep up and you shot the guy with a cell phone which is not a so it was it They've got a system and uh I I'll tell you that place was transformational uh on my life. The leaders are just a cut above everything. The operators the the average is just much higher than anything you'll find at the other teams. And even my first combat operation with them, like again back back to the psyche, I'm like watching them operate in combat, I'm like, "Okay, do do I deserve to be here?" Yeah.

Because they were moving. It was almost like watching a symphony.

Mike Sarraille1:25:49

Uh under some of the worst conditions that my first operation with with them was one of the worst firefights I've ever been in.

Mike Sarraille1:25:57

In Afghanistan.

Mike Sarraille1:25:58

It was the night that Adam Brown was killed. There's a book called Fearless.

Mike Sarraille1:26:03

Um and they went into a valley and mind you that it's 2010 when this is going down.

No Americans had ever stepped foot into this valley the entire Afghan war. It was that remote. And so all

Mike Sarraille1:26:18

Because where do you think the enemy senior leadership lived?

Mike Sarraille1:26:26

And even trying to find how to get into that valley took two weeks.

Really? Oh yeah, they they were utilizing every tool at their available route to get in uh within one period of darkness to assault the target, either capture or kill the bad guy and get out.

And what happened uh I can only describe as once they surrounded the target and and the raid began, the entire valley came alive. And and

Mike Sarraille1:27:00

They had uh they had trenches, prepared trenches. Um it was I'd been in some bad firefights in Ramani and Solder City, but this was like nothing I'd ever seen. Like

Mike Sarraille1:27:15

Well, they they moved the valley and everyone outside of that target moved to their positions. Um, and you know, a very unnerving feeling is a crack going over your head. Like when you hear that that distinct crack, you know that's very close.

But when that crack is multiple cracks in succession, you know that's a machine gun.

And uh it was I was in awe watching these guys cool, calm, and collective jump from rooftop to rooftop without communicating as if it was like synchronized execution without communication. like watching ninjas or something like how are these guys doing?

And like there was times where I'm like stay in the firefight cuz I'm like watching watching what's what's going on and uh my job that night was the radio and and I was also a JTAC which I can drop bombs from from aircraft. Um but then when Adam was killed that changed the the entire

Mike Sarraille1:28:09

Adam was asked to go move to a position to clear two guys that were behind a barricade.

Yeah. Um and uh he was shot while doing it and he's in the compound and so the guys had to expose themselves just selfless valor to great risk to go recover Adam's body and move him out of

Mike Sarraille1:28:32

Yes. Right.

And then to get out of there was like so this target was on the side of a mountain. Yeah. And one of the most amazing things about Afghanistan like it the mountains are gorgeous but they will cultivate the side of the mountain.

So think of a eight foot stone wall.

Mike Sarraille1:28:53

Then 50 yards of cultivated field. They must use dynamite or maybe they just dug but

And like 50 of those

Mike Sarraille1:29:02

Down the side of a mountain. And so they're farming cultivating on those those fields. And they had to get Adam's body down about 15 to 20 of those

In order for the helicopters to come in and get them uh get them out.

Mike Sarraille1:29:21

To to enemy fire.

Mike Sarraille1:29:22

So, they had to create some dispersion, some distance. And uh it was almost like Jesus Christ on a stretcher like they're getting shot at and they won't drop at them. Even though guys had to jump down an 8ft wall and then receive this the the the litter.

Mike Sarraille1:29:38

From from the guys above lowering it with care while getting shot at.

Mike Sarraille1:29:42

And it was it was uh

It I'll tell you after that mission I had wide eyes and there was a senior enlisted guy named Lou Langlish who was killed in the next deployment and he walked by me. He's like, "Mike, are you okay?"

Mike Sarraille1:29:55

And I'm like, "Lou, is every night like that?" And he's like, "Yep. Welcome. Welcome to the uh the command." And just walked away. And I'm like, "Oh [ __ ]

Mike Sarraille1:30:05

[ __ ]

And then that that just that just motivates you to like, "Okay, I got to step my game up. I got to learn quickly. Got to evolve." And um and I did. Um but watching them on the rest of that deployment um was was absolutely impressive. And uh I knew I was in the the place that I wanted to be. I was just going to have to work my tail off where I was not naturally gifted where where some guys were. I was just going to have to compensate, train, and and prepare uh where other guys maybe didn't have to prepare prepare uh in that way.

And and there's a lot of guys probably in the same boat that felt they had to

You go all in when you're you're part of that place. Like

That's your your your existence. Your your family

Mike Sarraille1:30:51

And that's your primary family and your primary focus. It's just it's the way it's got to be. And it sounds horrible to maybe your average American of like, well, no, you should always be taking care of your family. Well, I agree. I completely agree with that statement, but the needs of the mission and in that place uh supersede uh the family at times.

Mike Sarraille1:31:12

And and some people choose to leave

Because they they they can't handle that balance after uh a number of years. And nobody makes judgment. Nobody makes judgment. For me, I I was there six years, left in 2015, got there in 2009, got there, left there in 2016. And uh I look on it profoundly with with nothing but just profound uh

Gratitude. And uh I'd like to say there's no longing to go back, but uh maybe there is, but that just that part of my life is over. And

You're not getting that back. So it's what's the next challenge? what can I throw myself into that that offers me challenge and uh and hardship for for me to continue growing.

Mike Sarraille1:32:03

Yeah.

Mike Sarraille1:32:12

That's that's the nature of the the the target set you're going against. How would you differentiate Delta versus DEVGRU?

Cut from the same cloth. I actually got to do a tour as a troop commander over at Delta as part of an exchange tour

And I got to deploy with him as a troop commander. Phenomenal. Phenomenal. And and there's a lot of people out there on social media that wanted like, hey, one is better than the other.

The the caliber of the the assaulters were were were equal.

Mike Sarraille1:32:48

No, no, no, no. Are there outliers of guys who are who are Michael Jordan like within that profession? Absolutely.

Um but uh do do the places have specific maybe capabilities uh that the others doesn't? Yes, there there slight differences, but

They work together on a routine basis. Uh they they've got a good relationship and if people want to get into this game of who's better than other, it's just the young man's game, dude.

Yeah. It's when when you got a bunch of 40y olds and 50-y olds talking about, you know, we are better than like you look like sort of a you just look like Yeah. Yeah.

Mike Sarraille1:33:27

Yeah.

Mike Sarraille1:33:37

Um, and I succumbed to it. Uh, and so they hooked me up cuz at the time my wife was going back to Texas where she was from.

Mike Sarraille1:33:45

And uh, they got me a tour at the University of Texas, Naval ROC unit.

Mike Sarraille1:33:50

And uh, really rode out my last what year and a half there.

Mike Sarraille1:34:03

You know, that was when I drove away from Virginia Beach with with the U-Haul behind my uh Tacoma, I was not in a good headsp space and like just not not enjoyable to to to be around. So, it was it was a bit of a transition. Uh let's just say I was a mess in Austin hitting the bars uh freshly divorced uh while going through an NBA program and and part of the uh the Naval ROC. probably had the biggest beard of my career

Mike Sarraille1:34:31

While I was in uh in Austin.

Mike Sarraille1:35:01

Absolutely [ __ ] not.

Mike Sarraille1:35:11

No, no, no. Get me Don't get me wrong. Uh school was not my thing. Um and I'll take So, I was what 39, 40 going through that NBA program where the average age was 27.

Yeah. amongst kids that were uh and even academy grads who who were were much younger who were wildly intelligent.

Mike Sarraille1:35:30

And uh I learned more from those those I don't want to say kids uh my peers that were younger

Then sometimes I learned from the professors like grabbing somebody and being like hey how are you doing these formulas in Excel like

Show me. I was

I was not prepared for that MBA. Um, but it was it was a good transition for me and I was supposed to go back to what if you want to call it the fleet after that NBA. And

A great guy who's an admiral now, Tommy called me. He's like, "Hey man, where where do you want to go back to?" Cuz that tour was coming to an end. And I'm like,

Tommy, I'm I'm like at 19 and a half years and and I thought I was coming back after this. They were just giving me a rest. Yeah.

And I'm like, I think I'm just done, dude. I think I'm done. I I I'm like I I I was probably gonna be in the below zone to pick up Commander and I'm like, you know what, there's somebody who's younger, brighter, has more piss and vinegar. I I I thought this was going to be a recharge. I think it was a realization of like I'm just done. And the war was was really winding down at this point. Afghanistan, they said, was over. Yeah. Even though combat operations were going, but guys weren't getting to do as much.

And um

Like what was he going to go into a staff tour?

Yeah. like I don't want to be behind a desk like I got very unique career in the sense that

Enlisted to officer to the 20 years I got to deploy as a

Tactical uh leader uh the entire time and I'm like yeah it's just you know what I've recognized it's not my passion anymore

Um as much as I love the boys and I wanted to be there and um

I was just I was the the tank the tank was on empty

It was on empty

Interesting so the so what do you say just like put your paperwork in. I'll talk to to the admiral.

And literally called back that day and he's like, "You're a good man. Just submit your paperwork and we're going to fast track it." And so retired at uh 20 years in one month and uh you know, University of Texas wanted to do a ceremony and I'm like, "I'll be at the bar. If you have anything to drop uh drop off to me, you can drop it off there."

Um you do have to there was a you've got to go do your VA stuff and all all the processing and I did that over the course of the month, but

I just didn't want a ceremony. I'm like, "Hey, I don't want to put the uniform back on. I'm just done." And and I don't want to shave.

And so, we had a good blowout at the uh at the bar in Austin. And unfortunately, my then girlfriend, now wife, had to like go be home probably like 8 8:00 p.m. cuz we started at like 1:00. Everyone else had went out and had a good time. And uh that's just how it ended. And that's how I wanted it to end. And it I don't regret that. Um I wasn't big for pomp and circumstance.

Yeah. I don't Yeah. I never enjoyed the military, per se. Yeah.

As I say, I didn't miss the I don't miss the circus, but I do miss the clowns.

Mike Sarraille1:38:19

And uh and I was the clown with the biggest red nose.

I love the guys. I love the mission. I love doing it together. But all the the the the military as a whole, like I like I have an allergic reaction when I have to go on base now to get like my updated retired license. Just I'm like, "Oh."

Mike Sarraille1:38:52

So, I've got Martha McCllum here. Uh

Mike Sarraille1:38:54

Uh I'm going to take it from uh the airport. And then uh uh Sean Hannity, which uh Jason Chvitz, who who's a good friend is covering down firm. Um

Yeah, that is fun.

Yeah. Am I a So I don't I wouldn't say I'm a political pundit. I I do national security stuff and then I also tell veteran stories for Fox. That's fair.

I'm not a Fox employee.

Mike Sarraille1:39:16

Um I'll say this, I love Fox.

Mike Sarraille1:39:20

Working with Fox is on a whole different level than working with CNN or Good Morning America or any other network. That leadership and that culture is strong. And there's two leaders who who've been good to me and they've pulled me in. uh woman named uh Lauren Pettison who who like just would run circles around you and I. Yeah,

She's she's that good. And then a guy named Gavin Hayden who I've gotten really close with and Gavin has just looked out for me and um he's he's a mener in the space. Like this was never my career plan uh media. I have zero media training whatsoever.

Mike Sarraille1:40:09

Um, oh, I've had my my slip ups. Um, I was on Jesse Waters

And I was intending to say clock.

Mike Sarraille1:40:17

And I said [ __ ] and I smile and he's smiling and and I go right back into it and when the the segment cuts,

I'm like, "Yeah, that just happened." He's like, "I'll send you that bit. Please do." And then uh I got even my daughter was watching

Uh my 21-year-old. Yeah. She's like, "Dad." And I'm like,

"Yeah." And then guys uh of course the text messages started flying. Seals were like, "Bro, we didn't know you were uh we're like, "It's cool. We're just going to call you Rooster now." And I'm like, "All right, all right."

That's funny. Um, but uh, have you ever seen another network that puts an emphasis on well, not only love for our country, but our veterans and our service members?

No.

They're the only ones.

Mike Sarraille1:41:04

Oh yeah.

And they go the opposite. And and dude, you walk into Fox

And it's also different from walking into other networks. Even the big personalities who are these big famous people treat everyone with such respect and culturally that must be built.

Mike Sarraille1:41:24

I mean from Jesse to to Larry Cuddler who I I I really love to Martha McCllum who who

Mike Sarraille1:41:30

I look up to and and and Brian Kilme and all the rest. They they treat you with such kindness and respect. It's like why wouldn't you love that network?

Mike Sarraille1:41:40

And so is there a future there? That's for them to uh to determine. I'm not I don't think I'm as polished as you know like Joey Jones who who's a good friend is phenomenal and watching him grow

Over the years. He's he's just

Mike Sarraille1:41:56

I hope we we will see. But if they allow me to continue telling veteran stories like the unsung of Arlington or Final Flight or this Man of Honor,

Um I could build a legacy off of telling other veteran stories. I get a lot more joy out of telling other people stories. Um, and we even filmed an independent doc. Am I going to try to pitch it to Fox? Absolutely. It's called um, Rally Point Oscar. And I'm going to send you We We just showed this

Uh, at a data center conference uh, what500 2,000 people in the audience. Uh, 45 minutes. It's about 10 soldiers of the 520th Infantry. They served in a place called Seia Choy, which is in Kandahar, the birthplace of the Taliban.

Mike Sarraille1:42:43

Whoa.

And listening to their stories and and I'm I'm hosting it. I'm interviewing them.

Um I went home after 11 hours straight of of recording with these guys as we're feeding them beer as as you know, they're waiting for their turn. We're feeding them beer, which is a great tactic I know now. Like get your people drunk. Um, bro, there was not a dry eye in the audience. You had men hugging and and the testimonials. We did video testimonials. We had 40 people that did want. They're like, I want to do a testimonial on that. And we had to turn everyone else away because it was getting late.

Really? But I I'll tell you this. So, I I was in New York the day before we were supposed to film in Austin. We flew these 10 soldiers out and all these eight of the 10 now work in the same company. They were in the same platoon and now they're in the same private sector company, which so happens to be our company, Overwatch Mission Critical. I'm the chief talent officer of of the data center company. That's unheard of. Eight guys from the same platoon working in the same company.

That that doesn't happen.

Mike Sarraille1:43:43

Yes.

Mike Sarraille1:43:46

I I'll get to that piece.

Mike Sarraille1:43:48

But the day we're supposed to interview with them is on a Wednesday. So, I'd flown out to New York to do the final standup for uh Final Flight, the men of Extortion 17, which came out. Yeah.

On on the the 15th anniversary of that incident where I lost uh

Really good friends from my squadron um on August 6th, 2011.

So, I'm tired. Uh all flights out of New York get canceled because of the weather. So, I'm I'm calling uh my my right arm, a gal named Taylor. I'm like, "Bro, what do I do? Cuz I've got filming in Austin tomorrow, which we paid for the studio." She's like, "Can you get to Albany?" I'm like, "I'll do what I can." So, 4-hour drive to Albany, get in at like 3:00 a.m. Uh, get 30 minutes of sleep. Uh, cuz I got to get on an early flight which flies to Atlanta, gets into Austin.

I make it to Austin. Oh my god,

I'm exhausted.

And they've got like Alani's waiting for me and like the the the guy who produced and directed, a guy named Xavier, who used to do video content for Black Raffle Coffee, which we all know they're they're like a they're content kings. Yeah. And I like those guys. He's like, "Bro, you started interviewing the first guy and it's like your eyes opened up."

Mike Sarraille1:44:53

I mean, these stories were inspiring, but I'll send you the trailer and I'll send you the actual the first version that we showed at this conference, the final version, which comes out November 6, is is different.

Um, phenomenal. And it hit me at that moment. I'm like, you know what? We're going to do well with this this data center company. It'll set my family up for success, but I want to tell veteran stories for the rest of my life because there are hundreds upon hundreds of stories even from the global war on terror

Of infantry units that went through hell together

And those stories need to be told. But if the chronology is, you know, so I retire, finish up the MBA program, um I started a a company called Talent War Group. We we wrote a book called the talent war, how special operations and great organizations win on talent. It was an executive search firm that focused on small to medium-sized businesses, usually private, privately owned.

But we would take veterans, high performing veterans, and place them into management, sometimes seuite,

Sometimes general management VPs at these smaller to mediumsiz companies.

Um, and we placed a lot of veterans into great jobs and uh I also started doing keynote speaking at the same time. And I've just landed this last year as the number three leadership speaker in the world. Simon Synynic is number one. that mother and I don't think I'll ever unseat him.

Mike Sarraille1:46:19

Yeah, keep getting reps. But so we had a brief in the military uh all the time and that I mean I remember my first briefings in the military nervous as hell in front of senior officers and all the stumbles. But eventually you get enough iterations to where you get comfortable. The biggest thing is so the the the leadership speaking category is the largest and most comp competitive. You've got technologists, you've got think, you know, mental health speakers, but the leadership category is the is the the most competitive.

I didn't want to be the military guy. There are military speakers that get up and tell military stories, and they're good speakers.

Yeah. like you you hear guys like, you know, even Tim Kennedy, he he'll he'll tell a good story or or or or the other military speakers out there tell these great military stories where I'm I'm even like laughing my ass off or intrigued.

But um I've built a number of companies. Uh I sold the talent war group that got acquired to this data center company uh Overwatch mission critical. I'll tell you why why it matches. So executive search

Mike Sarraille1:47:19

Uh to overwatch and the CEO good good friend and a visionary he's a disruptor Kirk Oll he was Navy submariner on submarines his whole family all the his dad was a colonel in the air force all his brothers have uh served it goes back it's part of their lineage

Um it is a veteranowned veteranled company but the reason there was a a a sort of a one commonality is they are the largest provider we are the largest provider header of labor on construction management to the data center industry. QAQC's, uh, quality assessment, quality control, uh, construction program managers, uh, you know, schedulers, controllers, electricians, um, and we also do on the data center operation side once it's built, the people that that operate it. Uh, we have a GC, uh, a general contractor,

And then we do load banks, which are these devices to commission, um, data centers. So, we've grown and scaled rapidly. When I came on, when they acquired my company, they were at uh 19 million revenue. We're going to do well over 150 million this year, and I've only been with the company for 1.5 years. I'm good at the culture piece and the high performing like building teams. We were at like a 3.0 rating on Glass Door and Indeed. Uh we had 60 employees. We're now at 600 employees with a 4.8 rating on Glass Door and Indeed.

Mike Sarraille1:48:54

So our people, we've got people in 43 states. We have an office in uh Europe in a based out of London.

We've got people on all the major data center builds right now. That's

Very remote. Um and we still maintain this close relationship with our people. before I got here um we had a meet and greet like the entire sea suite and all the presidents every Tuesday and Friday get on with all the new employees as part of the onboarding a small part

To to introduce ourselves and to get to know them

And we do like a daily muster at 9:00 a.m. every morning where we play the national anthem.

Mike Sarraille1:49:30

To pay homage to the people that built or served this nation for the past 250 years and then we do 5 to 10 minutes of leadership development every single day. We have a theme every month. We have a lot of training. So, we've got something called Overwatch University, which I've got great like four amazing veterans, all senior enlisted warrants or officers, uh, that run it, that provide leadership training, uh, hard skills training. We double down on training. It's it's a belief that training cultures will defeat non-training cultures every day of the week and twice on Sunday.

Uh, we pour into our people, and I think that's what's led to the 4.8 uh, rating, which in the construction industry is unheard of. So we we protect our culture. We're deliberate and very intentional about our culture. We believe in pouring into our people. If our people are our primary focus, we know they'll serve the clients on each of the data center builds and we'll eventually get the uh returns for the stockholders that that are the investors. Um, and a great team from Kirk to, you know, Joe who's our COO, uh, army guy, Jesse, uh, Sergeant who was, uh, one of the guys in this documentary from the 520th enlisted soldier.

He's one of the co-founders and chief delivery officer, Mark Spears, who's, uh, our CFO. Like, bro, when once you have a ban like this, you don't break it up. Yeah.

Mike Sarraille1:50:57

And uh that conference we held we own we own the conference. It's one of the largest. It it is just different.

People are all smiles at this conference. It is we call it the people's conference.

It's called the data center anti-conference because we don't run it like other uh conferences. Um, but there is a large anti-data center movement right now, which is totally uh based off antiquated notions about power and water.

Mike Sarraille1:51:23

And Kirk is he's one of the top 10 global voices on data centers. He's the only one fighting it.

We've gotten him onto the hill to testify in in front of Congress. He's done some town halls. Just spoke to the governor's office last week. The guy has been in the industry uh for 25 years. one of the most like educated on the industry.

Mike Sarraille1:51:51

China.

Mike Sarraille1:51:52

And that's verified intelligence and and if you just saw this week uh Elon found or I should say X's his company found 200,000 uh accounts funded by the CCP putting misinformation. Of course, China wants us to slow our data center process. of course

Progress because we're in a race for AI dominance. When you see

Mike Sarraille1:52:32

So this this industry doesn't have regulation or governance the the the Texas will lead the way they're coming up on their 90th legisl legislative session uh this year in the number one uh focus is data centers because Texas is rapidly becoming the home you know it is the home of AI where Northern Virginia is the home of the cloud.

Yeah. So they will probably create a template for other states to follow and even the federal government. But the industry has been relatively self-regulated because they want to do what's right. And uh you know there are still some data centers that that use substantial water because they have not been modernized.

Mike Sarraille1:53:13

But most of the data centers almost all the data centers being built today use a clos looped water system. Uh which is what we call a zero water design.

Yeah. Water doesn't dissipate heat. Well,

Mike Sarraille1:53:32

They are. So,

Mike Sarraille1:53:33

the grid left of meter. Um, so data centers have not created a power problem. They've exposed an issue with our national grid and the grid has been ignored. These companies are creating what you call left of meter independent island generation. So they're building their own power plants, whether that's natural gas uh produced,

But it has the ability to stabilize

Uh and even reinforce the local grid for residents in whatever town it's being built and sometimes stabilize it to a point where it brings the energy price for uh res residential energy prices

Mike Sarraille1:54:16

to the locals." without a doubt in in the data center industry and all my talking points come from Kirk.

He he's considered him a mentor within this space to to educate me

And then what I've read and and I continue to do that. I find this space the national security implications of this space alone are vast

And so that's why you know when

He bought my company

And there I was going to stay on for part of the transition to to make sure that that that business unit was up and running he asked me to become the chief talent officer

And specifically said uh you know build me a bulletproof culture

And I said I'll do that but in fact I'll build you a futurep proof culture which is more important to me

And you know I called my my my dad and I'm like hey should should I take this position And it was almost like a he's like this industry is like this is the future. He's like this isn't even a question. Take the job. And uh I want to I love the team. I mean it's a blueco collar industry. These people building the these these these data centers. It's going to create so many jobs. But what AI is going to do for us and I know there's a fear of AI and job replacement.

Mike Sarraille1:55:51

Every industrial revolution has caused job displacement

Mike Sarraille1:56:25

Longevity,

Mike Sarraille1:57:19

Most most people when when they have to face change see fear.

Yeah. And it's a mindset thing. But you know this it's almost like a reverse parasitic effect with the data center industry. It's only growing. The demand is only uh growing because of technology and people like their technology. And so what the biggest like irony or hypocrisy here is this anti anti-data center movement and we did this town hall in cibilo Texas. We have nothing to do with that project. Kirk was going to come in just to educate people on the data center industry and answer any questions.

Bro, it was it was a blood bath. We didn't know what we were stepping into and the city didn't run it well. Uh well intended. They just didn't run it well.

And people weren't from CBO. They people had been

Mike Sarraille1:58:07

Bust in [ __ ] And uh

Mike Sarraille1:58:14

Yeah. I would say check their IDs before they enter, but we can't even get IDs passed uh to to verify voters.

Mike Sarraille1:58:21

Totally absurd. So, the irony is, hey, you drove here in your Tesla.

You're recording this with your iPhone. All of those are dependent on data centers. So,

If you don't want data centers, then tell the the tech industry to to slow their progress. Yeah.

On whether you want your Tik Tok data center.

Mike Sarraille1:58:44

You you want your first responders responding in rapid time data center.

Mike Sarraille1:58:53

Do you want access to your photos through through your iPhone data? Like

What do you want? Um and nobody wants to nobody wants a highway built next to their home. Nobody wants to be on a uh a flight line or a path a flight pathway

Mike Sarraille1:59:09

So, yes, the the the data center has to do some things differently. They've got to be a value ad to uh to to towns and and they're recognizing that. Hey, listen. We're going to come in. We're going to add a line item that, you know, and I heard this idea th being thrown around. We're we got your water bill and your uh your your electric bill covered.

Mike Sarraille1:59:42

And they have and Sam Sam Alman I I I don't know what what uh medium it was on but he just did an interview and he's like you know what if towns don't want them we're going to go into very rural areas where there are no humans and we're going to build these things

Mike Sarraille1:59:58

That's that's the next economy. If if if you have patience, I would start investing in these space companies because that is going to be completely the space economy is going to be massive. Yeah. I'm way overexposed in space. Oh yeah. I was like, you know what?

Mike Sarraille2:00:32

You you know what's going to be the next fight and we're going to see the same thing. So SMR, small modular reactors, nuclear.

Mike Sarraille2:00:39

Everyone's recognizing there's multiple companies in this space now. We're maybe anywhere from three to like seven years away from from these really being rolled off.

Mike Sarraille2:00:48

One people and there's a great documentary by Oliver Stone of all people called Nuclear Now. If you ever have an opportunity, go watch it. It talks about the psychology of nuclear and

The Navy has been nuclearpowered submarines and subsurface vessels for over 60 years with zero incidents.

Mike Sarraille2:01:06

It's safe.

But you will see an anti-uclear movement start even though you wanted zero carbon emissions, right?

Mike Sarraille2:01:08

Who Who's the uh I've never read his books. The uh is it Ryan Holiday?

Mike Sarraille2:01:30

The The Daily Stoic.

Mike Sarraille2:01:32

He just posted and I I put a comment where he's got his middle finger towards some data center thing in Austin.

Yeah. Very little. and like just ranting and raving on the data center industry and I'm like that is sort of the irony that you built your entire like business off of social media which is run through data centers

Mike Sarraille2:01:55

Yeah.

But that is people are going to have an allergic reaction and the data center will will adjust and I think uh politicians will stay away from this

Until a middle ground is found. Yeah,

But even politicians that were pro data centers a year ago are now like retracting and they won't even talk.

We're heading to the Hill uh September 14th to the 18th to to do some podcasts with with some politicians and they're like

We will not discuss data centers. We're like, okay, we'll we'll discuss national security. There you go.

Mike Sarraille2:02:29

So, uh we did that trip 7 thing. Do you remember that where we

Stood up a team alongside Andy Stumpf where there's been this

Long-standing feat in the international skydiving community

To jump into seven continents within seven days and multiple groups have tried since the uh the 80s and all had failed. Pulled together uh nine veterans, mostly special operations veterans to two Marines. Uh some of them were the Black Rifle Coffee Guys, guy named Log Logan Stark who's phenomenal.

Mike Sarraille2:02:58

He went he was a Marine sniper, fought in Afghanistan. uh actually produced a independent doc while he was in at Michigan State that got like 9.5 million views. It's called For the 25 25 guys they lost.

Mike Sarraille2:03:13

And then that's how Black Rifle Coffee in the early days discovered him and he was an early member of Black Rifle Coffee. Um so we ended up doing it. It was 18 months of planning. Nobody All it was was a logistical jigsaw puzzle that nobody could figure out.

We figured it out

And 18 months of planning we did it. We set four world records and we lined up to to our benefit because we were raising money for Folds of Honor. Uh Fox and Friends and Fox and Friends the executive producer at the time was a guy named Gavin Hayden who I mentioned to you.

He's now the uh executive vice president of Fox Nation and uh this just speaks to Fox. This

Gavin Gavin is is the consmate representative. So we go on Fox and Freds that that hit alone raised 150,000. Yeah. for Folds of Honor. And he asked, he's like, and this is a guy who's probably been up since 3:00 a.m. and you know, it's now like 11 a.m. He's like, "Have you guys been to the World Trade Center Museum?" And most of us were like, "No, we we haven't."

He's like, "I'll take you." So, even though he wants to be home with his family and probably get some sleep, he takes us through that museum, which was like a 4-hour process and launch with us. And we started talking and we just we hit it off. And uh I don't know if it was that day or in later text messages he's just like, "Hey man, we we want to do something with you. We've got a series called The Unsung of Arlington, which tells the story of lesser known veterans laid to rest in Arlington.

Mike Sarraille2:04:47

"No, I'm in." Because if we're telling the story to veterans Yeah.

Yeah. Then then I want to be a part of it. even if I'm behind the camera. Um, and so that series went well. That was season one. We just finished season two and released it uh this past May. Um, and then that led to another one and it led to another one. Hey, can you commentate on what's going on in uh Israel right now with in in Palestine with the is Israel Hamas? And I'm like, yeah, I I can speak to it tactically um and somewhat on a strategic level.

And and that hit to where they just kept calling back. I'll tell you what though, I am here. Here's So, this company demands everything.

Yeah. From me. While still doing the keynote speaking, while having a 2-year-old, while finishing up a manuscript, and I'm on a three three-week timeline here to finish up this manuscript, this book I have coming out in January.

And then to get a call to go on Larry Cuddlo's show, same day at, you know, it may be it may be uh 10 a.m. in the morning. Hey, can you come on, Larry? at 2 p.m.

Mike Sarraille2:05:51

And that's what it I mean managing all that like I'm doing a lot of things. Maybe I'm not doing a lot of things well. Uh and I'll probably be harder hardest on myself. But there's a part of me that says, "Hey, if I was focused on the production side full-time, I think I would crush it." Like if that was my sole focus. And and I I do want to get to that point uh to where we're we're doing these projects because there are so many stories to be told on the selfless valor that millions display during the global war of terror or even past wars.

Mike Sarraille2:06:26

And um

Mike Sarraille2:06:29

Yes.

Mike Sarraille2:06:33

So we've been at war with Iran since 1979. Yeah. 47 years.

Right. And no president has done a thing about it. I just told you, you know, when you look at the Beirut bombings, which we lost, you know, over 300 Marines,

Uh the Cobbar Towers, who do you think backed uh Hamas in in Palestine on October 7th in which if people don't, it was something like 39 Americans were killed. Yeah. on October 7th, all the troops cuz Iran Iran was flooding in weapons in uh into Iraq during the global war on terror and these things called explosive forming penetrators which were killing American troops.

Mike Sarraille2:07:14

Their missile production and manufacturing was going exponential to the point where nobody could have stood against them. You combine that missile uh production with nuclear ambitions and the ability to put a warhead even if a dirty bomb not fully enriched y

Uh which could kill millions. Somebody had to do something about it. And so many administrations had buried their head in the sand or done some agreement to which Iran never honors any agreement. Uh it was just a a uh it was political optics.

Yeah. they would have been a threat to not only that region but eventually the the Europe and then the United States. It's the same thing. You know, if you ever heard the stories in 1998, Clinton had the opportunity to do a strike on Bin Laden. Yes. And and

Mike Sarraille2:08:06

Can can we definitively say that that would have prevented 9/11? No.

But when you have an opportunity like that with somebody who preaches death to America, you got to take the shot.

Yep. uh the price of inaction will always be more consequential than the price of action.

And um I I give nothing but praise to President Trump for the moral clarity to do what multiple presidents should have done in the past.

Mike Sarraille2:09:11

So we've made great strides since this this thing started. Every war is a mismanagement. There's there's a level of mismanagement. Hopefully, you manage it to to be uh the least amount possible. So, to think that we're going to do this shock and awe campaign from the air and and inflict uh regime regime change uh is a fool's errand. Have we degraded their military substantially? Do they have a residual missile missile and drone capability? They do. um this economic this uh economic fury has been crippling and they continue to layer sanctions uh what what do they call this last round um economic outcast I think was the

Um so you know once you shut down Iran's access to financial institutions they move to exchanges you shut that down they move to gold you shut gold down and then they move to crypto third parties and and and other things and slowly they're they're they're isolating and containing ing Iran to have access to any financial system and that is they are I mean you've seen the inflation you've seen their currency in absolute uh freefall it is having an impact and running a country is no different than running a business you can't I mean cash is like oxygen and they have none

Mike Sarraille2:10:32

The blockade is is devastating to them you've got to give it time and maybe that's where the Trump administration just didn't handle the narrative and set expectations as well. But you've got to stay the course. What I'm You've got to have some blame on our allies here and especially the regional partners. Like at some point, you got to get off the bench. This is impacting you, especially with the Venezuela deal that we just uh signed with the access to the oil.

It's not impacting us. Even though the price of gas is up globally, it's not impacting us as much as our European partners. uh and China's feeling the uh the impacts because now they've lost access to black uh market oil through Iran.

It is it it has the potential to end in a very favorable way for not only the US but the world and the regional partners.

Mike Sarraille2:11:22

This is what you need to do. So you've got the diplomacy that you were seeing alignment like we've never seen in in the region where you know you had Pakistan, Turkey and Saudi Arabia signed a uh a defense pack which is an attack on one is an attack on all. I think you have a potential for an Abraham's accord 2.0.

Mike Sarraille2:11:41

Um Saudi Arabia just moved all anti-semitic language from any material in any school.

Mike Sarraille2:11:46

That's a these are the indicators and this is because of Trump. You got to give him credit. Um, we have the economic warfare and that is absolutely working. That just takes a little bit of time. Ultimately, if you want regime change and that should be the ultimate goal. Their military is degraded, their strike capabilities is substantially uh degraded. You know, their soldiers aren't being paid and ideology only goes so far when you can't put food on the table.

What they need to do is what you call uh covert uh military action.

Mh. where you start to arm, you start to train the the the people within Iran to rise up against the the regime. That's how it ultimately falls. So Iran right now has to look north, south, east, and west for enemies. When they have to start looking internal cuz I mean their their playbook has been oppression of the people since uh 1979. When they have to fight that external war and now have to fight an internal war, that's how regimes become brittle. That's how regimes uh are ultimately replaced.

But I think America's appetite for war given the 24 de 20-year debacle that we we dealt with uh they just don't have an appetite and they don't want to play pay uh high prices at the pump. I get it. You got to stay the course. Our will ultimately has to be greater than theirs. And right now like the enemy knows that like the election cycle that we have in the in the United States is a weakness to our ultimate uh you know international strategy. And it's the same thing with the global war on terror.

No administration did a good job of hey this isn't going to be over in 5 years, 10 years, 20 years. This is going to be a generational fight against Islamic terrorism and ideology and we may be in Afghanistan for the next 60 years.

Yeah. Leaving Afghanistan and not holding on to Bram with a minimal amount of troops was what I think the biggest mistake we made due to the geography alone because China, Russia and Iran did not like us in Afghanistan.

Yeah. I mean from a uh intelligence surveillance and reconnaissance uh aspect. Could you imagine if we started this Iranian war and had Bram? Yeah. And we're flying fighters out of Bram to come from the east. It in and it puts pressure on Pakistan as well which is part of the China's uh belt and road initiative.

Mike Sarraille2:14:15

It was that that piece of terrain alone had such strategic value that we should have held on to Bram. That recommendation came from not only the military to to to the Trump Trump administration to the Biden administration. It came from politicians and both administrations ignored it and we ultimately pulled out. We all know who that went.

Mike Sarraille2:15:11

Not going to happen. But so, I'll tell you um what's your take on the whole thing? If if we zoom out th this is why again previous administrations have let the western hemisphere become a vulnerability to us and and Trump understood that and and

It's what are they calling it the Trump Trump uh Monroe doctrine or the Trump row doctrine

Mike Sarraille2:15:41

100% like there can be zero access to our adversaries in the western Hemisphere and we have to have that on lockdown, which is a good way to say it. Venezuela was a front door to the Western Hemisphere for not only China and Russia, but even some of this these terrorist groups, Hamas, Hezbollah,

Mike Sarraille2:16:00

And he basically shut that off. And then he took their oil off the black market. Yeah.

And now it's on the open market.

Mike Sarraille2:16:07

And now we have access to it. Like the it worked out favorably and and and it was well done.

Mike Sarraille2:16:17

So I I put my phone on silent when like I I go to sleep. I woke up to to some text from some bookers for Fox like, "Hey, can you come on?" Which I totally missed.

And so I open turn on the TV and they're talking about the Delta Force raid. And I'm I just smiled.

And all I can say is like, "Well done, boys." And and that this generation is they're smarter, they're faster, they're stronger, just like pro athletes. technology though. Like

They are so much more technologically advanced.

They're completely incapacitated in a walled stand to the presidential palace and snatched them before he could get in a safe room. The whole thing is like a [ __ ] spy novel. I feel like a dinosaur now. If you threw me on the battlefield, I'd open my mouth and guys would be like, "Okay, yeah, we're going to put you in this corner over here and just observe." Like this the the the the military and the special operations guys we have now are so freaking good. We were good for our era in our generation.

These guys are better and that's the whole freaking point. Um, but the Delta guys absolutely in the TF-160th absolutely crushed that.

Mike Sarraille2:17:27

That's that's the grit and that is the the the determination and the strength of of our forces. And to see him be awarded the Medal of Honor. And first off, did you see the size of that guy?

Oh my god. Giant. like it was straight out of central casting like what you would think like a Arnold Schwarzenegger military movie would be

Mike Sarraille2:17:46

Yeah.

Mike Sarraille2:17:52

Weapon

For a some sort of sound weapon that that that must mess with somebody's vestibular system to the point where it forces them to

Nausea and and straight up you just puking on the ground.

Mike Sarraille2:18:11

The the evolution of warfare that's happening at such an accelerated rate. This is why business is so hard and this is why like futurep proofing high performance teams is so important moving into the future cuz technology disruption cycles are shortening. The current disruption cycle is not waiting uh for the next one to start.

Yeah. And things are accelerating at such a a rapid rate. Even the last four years with regards to the evolution of of warfare, it's completely changed. I mean, a lot of it's taking place in in Ukraine.

Mike Sarraille2:18:46

And we are behind on drone production and and we're catching up fast. We're we're recognizing it. Everything with AI, autonomous vessels. I mean, it's a it's a former dev group guy that started Seronic.

Mike Sarraille2:19:07

Hey, I like I cannot wait until the day I hope I get the opportunity to meet that guy. If there's anyone in the technology space that you want to like sit down and have a drink with, it's this guy.

Mike Sarraille2:19:41

I even saw Sean Ryan shooting a uh remote machine gun the other day. I'm like, Jesus, the the the future of war is going to be like a hundred robots running out there with guns out. Thank God for guys like like Elon and uh Dino who started Seronic and all these companies because the defense industrial base is completely changing as it should. It is becoming they're approaching it

I would say the department of war is approaching acquisitions now more like software less like hardware.

Mike Sarraille2:20:09

And Andrew and Seronic and all these other companies are now producing things at such a rapid rate at a lower cost. I mean, basically warfare is becoming unit economics when you think about it. When

Ukraine is producing a drone that, let's say, costs 5,000 all in between the drone and and the warhead.

Mike Sarraille2:20:27

And a $5,000 drone takes out a 1 million or $2 million tank.

Mike Sarraille2:20:31

You can't sustain that. And we saw that with the the reporting on the on deped munitions. Yeah.

Uh very using very exquisite missiles to take out uh a $25,000 drone.

Mike Sarraille2:20:46

And what Andrew's producing across the front from anti- drone warfare to drones, one-way attack drones to even what Seronic is doing.

Like I it makes me smile. And now every country is trying to ramp up or accelerate manufacturing

For the way that war is now going to be fought.

Mike Sarraille2:21:10

Sub? Yeah.

Yeah. Oh my god. just watching that I like and and also had one that recovered the two uh Apache pilots at sea.

Mike Sarraille2:21:22

Think about sitting back in Austin at that company. You hear that just happening and I'm sure they're a part of it and they're tracking it.

You're just like, "Oh, bro, this company is like we're unstoppable. Stock stock price is going up. Valuation is going up and we need more of it." It's the the the biggest thing is we have outsourced almost everything. Yeah.

And China right now is shoring up everything to make sure they can manufacture everything they need within China.

And in a lot of ways we're doing the same. I mean that's where Trump with the the he will be recognized for rebuilding our manufacturing capacity within this uh within this country

Because we cannot rely on allies and outsourcing any of our our production that we are relying upon. Yeah. And with the uh the fab uh you know semiconductor plants being built uh not only in uh Arizona, but I'm sure you saw that one that uh Elon proposed outside Houston. Yeah. Was it?

That's something like 10 times the size of the Pentagon.

Mike Sarraille2:22:22

G. It's going to be a lot bigger than a giga factory. That thing's going to be like 20 g gigawatts. I've got a lot of optimism for where we're going. Yeah. Um, but also when you when you insource, how many jobs do you bring back into the United States? Yeah.

Which is I I don't think a lot of Americans, here's what I'll say. A lot of Americans don't think working with their hands. They think they're above working with their hands. I think the biggest mistake for the last three decades or if not more, uh, the biggest mistake we've made was telling our youth that any measurable success required a college degree.

Mike Sarraille2:23:27

Blueco collar millionaires.

Mike Sarraille2:23:44

So, let me tell you what we've done. Overwatch mission critical. We and this is funny. So Kirk and I wrote an article uh that was a Fox oped that basically said we have a major shortage electricians, plumbers, HVAC techs, keep keep on going, especially for what the demand the Ford uh the Ford demand that that requires more electricians. And then you've got this current generation, the silver tsunami that are going to retire out. It's going to make the problem worse. that basically if you want to encourage our our youth to go into the trades, then incentivize them by creating some major tax deductions for that first 10 years of being an electrician.

You're paying next to nothing for for taxes. It's it's what we need to get more people into the trades.

That article was seen by a bunch of West Pointers that started a company called Forge Now

Mike Sarraille2:24:31

Um and they basically and these guys were were not in the trades. They're, you know, investment bankers that created the schoolhouse, six week boot camps

To produce electrician apprentices,

HVAC techs, plumbers. Um, run a lot like the military, no yelling or anything like that, but kids have to wear this a uniform every day. They have to show up at 7 a.m. If you miss or you're late twice, you're out.

But they they're not only creating practitioners within the trades, they're trying to create leaders. Yeah. and their success rate, their graduation rate is higher than any technical school that averages between 25 to 40% graduation, they're at 90%.

Mike Sarraille2:25:09

Well, they also put people up in lodging as well as food for roughly about $12,000.

Mike Sarraille2:25:20

So, they reached out and said, "We loved your article." And I said, "Hey, what do you guys do?" And I said, "We need to talk. I'm going to be in Dallas the next day." So, I met up with them. like we are short trades in the data centers. We now have a partnership forge now data centers. It's a JV between us and them where we have courses where we're producing taking the electricians and say hey do you want to be a construction PM as well that go through and they're they're an assistant program manager uh construction project manager uh coming out data center operator and we continue layer courses where veterans can use their GI bill and the data center is like this is exactly what we need.

It's what America needs. The only problem with Forbes now is it can't just be in Dallas. It's got to be in Phoenix. It's got to be in California. It's got to be in New York. It's got to be

Mike Sarraille2:26:12

They are. You You know how hard it is to run a business. You want to you want to nail this one thing in Dallas first. And And

Mike Sarraille2:26:21

Oh, they're great. They are Oh, I love them.

Mike Sarraille2:26:34

What What I've seen some high schools do, and I I freaking love this concept. Um you know how you have a college signing day for somebody who's going to go play football.

Uh I can't remember the area that was doing this, but basically they were having a signing day for the kids that were going to technical schools to become

Oh, that's crazy. and uh you know putting on the hat of the the technical school they were going to.

Unsung heroes. Every single highway we drive on, every modern uh skyline you see like Nashville over here were built by people that work with their hands.

Mike Sarraille2:27:07

The railroads the the the electrical electrical system that we know today. I mean there is purpose in those jobs. And um we we got away from from putting those people up on our shoulders and celebrating them.

Mike Sarraille2:27:39

Well, it I'm not I'm not trying to college is is a route for some people. Was college my greatest education? Even the NBA program? Yeah,

Mike Sarraille2:27:56

The greatest education

Is travel. It's it's just stepping into the arena and learning from great coaches and men mentors on the job training

Uh that prepare it. And this guy, I look up to this guy. He's the president of Roseden Electric,

Which is one of the largest electrical contracting uh firms. I think they're they're approaching like a 20 billion.

Mike Sarraille2:28:22

And this guy started as an electrician apprentice. He's now the president of Rosidin. His name is uh Justin Tanokco. What I love about Rosidan, yeah. Was started out of San Jose uh where where I went to high school is their ESOP program, employee stock option uh program

And they're creating millionaires, these guys who are electricians. I mean, they are a generous company and they're large. They they're one of the largest electrical contractors and you talk to people that that work at Rosen. They love that company.

Mike Sarraille2:29:01

Eddie got screwed.

Eddie did not need to go through that with his family. And

You want a funny story?

Yes. So Eddie happens on on

Mike Sarraille2:29:13

Eddie Gallagher uh basically was accused of war crimes for killing a ISIS soldier.

Mike Sarraille2:29:31

To which a lot of people would be like, "That's wrong to me." I'm like, "Isn't that the [ __ ] point?" Yeah. Um,

Mike Sarraille2:29:47

It doesn't bode well. I mean, let's just say I have no love loss for anyone who's an Islamic terrorist,

Right? I'm zero zero with you. And and that's years of scars. Um, and I've got my my prejudices and my biases. But it's the same thing of like when when a bunch of seals went to a strip club and one of them knocked somebody out, some civilian. Uh and and people would be all upset and be like, "What what what did you expect? Let's first off, let's find out the story." Oh, the guy talked trash to one of our guys. Yeah. And and he handled the problem.

Like we're going to punish him. He's we're going to get our pound of flesh. He'll learn from it. But like I'm not going to over rotate on this.

Mike Sarraille2:30:21

So yes, this plays into the story. So, you know, Eddie's house was raided on said date. Um about six months prior to that, I'm retiring. I was involved in an incident on December 2nd of 2012. I was in Jalalabad where they launched the the raid on Bin Laden a year earlier and al Qaeda had launched a attack on that base. I just happened to be the the strike force commander of that that that section of the base at the time uh in retaliation for the raid on midlan.

Wicked firefight lasted like two and a half hours where finally we just had to drop danger close bombs with with my initials on them and uh we were the first to respond because it was like right on our base and uh so there was a great army special forces element on the other side of the airfield and it took them like 45 minutes to get to the firefight. Um, and the ODA captain received the distinguished service cross and it had like things that my guys had done in the the citation and it said he dropped bombs when it was my CCT with my initials.

They dropped bombs.

And what what he forced me to realized is that I I didn't really submit guys for the awards. Um, and we had a car bomb detonated on us that like knocked guys out. Um, and so I said, "You know what? Uh, what may have seemed like a big firefight to them, my guys had so many firefights, it was just like, oh, it was another Tuesday." And I'm not trying to sound cool.

Mike Sarraille2:31:57

Um, and I'm like, "You know what? I failed the guys." So, I called my commanding officer, who's the commanding officer who was on that base at the time, and said, "Hey, I I need to rectify this. This story wasn't accurate. I'm not here to denigrate the army, but I didn't recognize the guys, and they're they're deserving Silver Stars." He's like, "Yeah, you're you're probably right." And so put the package together. Uh Seal Warcom, the the overarching command said, "Okay, you've got to route this through a congressman." Which was sort of weird.

And so this is like months before I'm retired. And I'm like, "Why wouldn't you guys just route it?" So I do it. And on the day I retire, I get a call from Warcon, the overarching SEAL Command. They're like, it was a guy named I'll just say John. And uh he's like, "Hey, Mike. How you doing?" I'm like, "Oh, good, good. You calling to congratulate me on my retirement?" He's like, "No, no, but is that today?" And I'm like, "Yes, I'm officially out." He's like, "No, unfortunately, I'm calling to tell you you're being investigated by NCIS for mishandling of classified information." Cuz when I routed the awards to get my guys recognized,

You got to be careful about what names of certain commands and there was no way of getting around it. And I knew that was a But uh even that same guy, Tommy, who's now an admiral, he's like, "Yeah, dude. Do do the right thing. Get your guys recognized." Um, so then NCIS, and this is all the NCIS in in San Diego, it's nothing like the TV show. These guys had they are civilians and usually the director or the secretary of the Navy is directly over NCIS.

And if it's a left-leaning Secretary of the Navy, uh, they just had it out for SEALs. So this NCIS in San Diego,

They're civilians. They're not even Navy. Some some are Navy, some are uh criminal investigators that are technically DoD employees, okay, civilian employees. And uh they they wanted to find SEALs to prosecute. Like it was just their they had this agenda. And so I'm getting phone calls. The first phone call I get from NCIS, this uh guy is talking he's playing playing bad cop. And I'm like, "Hey man, like look at my record for the last 20 years. Like it's clean and and 10 combat deployments. I'm trying to get my guys recognized.

That's only intent here. And he is just just trying to to to rattle me. And then finally some other guy speaks on the phone after 10 minutes. And I'm like, "Well, how long have you been listening to this conversation?" And he's trying to play good cop and they're like, "Hey, we need you to turn your computer in." I'm like, "No, I'm not turning my computer in."

Mike Sarraille2:34:26

So, at this point, I didn't want to get lawyers and and I'd gone through a divorce. I wasn't financially solvent. um paying for the NBA.

Um I was not in a good place financially

And so

Mike Sarraille2:34:41

I didn't answer any like material questions. So Admiral McCraven got involved cuz he actually advised me to to route and get these guys recognized. And he actually tried to to bring it to the SOCOM to commander at the time which his team totally ignored me um because they felt that it would tell an opposing story to what the army had told. And so, uh, I'm getting it from NCIS. They're threatening to raid my house.

Mike Sarraille2:35:10

This is before Eddie.

Mike Sarraille2:35:15

No, but we we always knew that if NCIS got involved, we were always told, "Go get a civilian lawyer." Okay. Lawyer up.

Mike Sarraille2:35:23

So, they go to Admiral McCraven and they they wipe his computers of anything that was discussed with this uh this incident. And so I am starting to freak out because one, I'm not in a financially good position.

Uh some lawyers gave me time like former Jags.

Mike Sarraille2:35:39

And they're going to bat for me and these guys are trying to make my life miserable and eventually, you know, came to like turn in your computer. We're going to make sure that they only do a search for uh for for this specific information that it will be wiped from your computer. I'm like, just don't let them go into my like browser search history. I'm joking. Yeah. Um

Mike Sarraille2:36:00

It it was it was a horrible experience, but it was also good in the sense that I'm like, "Okay, yeah, government, I'm officially done with you." Like you made this very clear.

And then 6 months later, about 6 months, I hear about the Eddie thing

And that they raided his house, put his family through that, which was totally unnecessary.

Mike Sarraille2:36:11

two kids were home to put to put children through that and to put the family through that and then to hold him for that long when he wasn't a flight risk that and and you I mean the Apple documentary on it is phenomenal about just the just malfeasants the the the the just decrepit nature of the NCIS.

Uh we always knew NCIS was not was not your friend. They always had an agenda.

Mike Sarraille2:37:18

That that was that was disturbing on a lot of levels. Now, if if you want to go to leadership and I I had Eddie on one of my podcasts where we talked about it and you know what whatever was going on with Apple, there was there there was dissent.

Mike Sarraille2:37:46

Yeah. You've got to be careful. One, and I'm not saying Eddie was doing this. People that were out to make a name for themselves

Mike Sarraille2:37:54

Were a threat to everyone around him.

Like, oh, I'm going to get this this high kill count. Like,

Nobody cares, bro.

Mike Sarraille2:38:02

Like, you your value as a human is not going to be judged by how many en enemy combatants you killed.

Yeah. Um, and I found that fascinating when I got to Dev Group because Team Three, some guys were keeping kill counts and I I don't I don't I don't want to get in the subject. The leadership at three was not the best period of my life. And I've got a group of

Guys who we all came up at team three that all did full careers, some are still active and we we rip on team three in that culture at the time.

I'll leave it at that. And then when I got to Dev Group, like they're like, "Yeah, nobody keeps kill counts here. What does it what does it matter?"

Yeah. Like they're like, "We're losing this war anyways."

Mike Sarraille2:38:40

Like we they keep putting targets on the deck. We keep taking them out only to be filled with more targets behind them. Like I found that very interesting, very professional on the side of the dev group guys.

Um that they could recognize, yeah, we're going to kill a lot of enemy combatants, but at the end of the day, we're not we're not that's not the measure of success here. It's can we degrade the network to where they stop fighting or they no longer have access to to certain regions of this country. Got it. Um, talk about your new book teams. Uh, the attributes and harsh realities of high performance. So, it's all about high performing teams. It uses trip 7 as the story line.

Mike Sarraille2:39:20

Um, but having been across a a number of domains just like you from the military to the business world to extreme sports uh to to the keynote industry. Um because keynote industry is not individualistic. I didn't hit number three in the world. My team hit number three in the world. I've got people doing PR. I've got people doing media. I've got deck uh production. Um I've got operations. Like all those people is what helped me get to number three. And so I've always been fascinated by by uh high performing teams.

You watch something like The Last Dance, which I know you've seen, which I like I've I've binged on that thing no less than three times.

Yeah. A lot of people one it's like CEOs everyone says that you know their team is high performing when they can't even define it and if you can't define it you can't build it you definitely can't lead it um and high performance is not what people think it's when people see high performing teams in action like I've seen uh people will be like it's cutthroat uh there's a lot of friction uh you know they the way they talk to each other is is not necessarily inappropriate but very direct and and candid and they think that's a failure of the system though.

That that is the system of high performance.

Mike Sarraille2:40:33

Um and so it goes into all the attributes of what it takes to to build high performing teams regardless if you're a business leader or if you're in the military or if you're you're you're in sports or any other domain. But then it goes into the realities that people don't talk about that that you and I uh know so well that the relationships that are destroyed uh that you know how teams will find connection in the mission at the moment because they are so aligned and focused on what success looks like in achieving it that the second that stops the mission is over.

Uh you know certain relationships are afraid. Maybe somebody got more attention than the others. But what about the emotional, spiritual, psychological, and physical toll of high performance that it takes on people? Destroyed marriages, destroyed relationships, the adrenaline dump, uh the the executive burnout, and and also, you know, basically telling leaders that you've got to watch out for this. You've got to plan for it. I had a lot of fun writing this book. Um we are on like the fifth revision of the manuscript. I it's not that the first final manuscript wasn't ready.

It's just that's more of me like nope doing another review

Because even from when I finished the the first manuscript the full manuscript all 12 chapters that was like six months ago.

Mike Sarraille2:41:50

And then I speak to a company and I learn about the companies before I speak to them and then all of a sudden I have a new concept. Yeah.

And I'm like nope that needs to go into the book. I'd tell the publisher, hold I'm I'm

Mike Sarraille2:42:03

Blackstone, which is awesome. So, they're number one in audio books.

Mike Sarraille2:42:07

In my first two books

Mike Sarraille2:42:10

Because I just didn't want to put them in front of publisher. I didn't know that that route

Until somebody a good friend at Fort Tier PR said, "Bro, you got to put your next book in front of publisher."

Picked up like that. Yeah. I I only sent them I think a few chapters and then I sent them the full manuscript and they they're like this is a highlighter book is how they referred to it

And they have been phenomenal and I'm looking forward to a future. I enjoy writing. Am I particularly good at it?

I that's for somebody else.

Mike Sarraille2:42:40

Yeah. So I had a a great guy Michael Kofino uh based out of the Bay Area lawyer. Um I do most of the writing then he takes my crayon yeah uh drawings and and helps uh put into flow or help like hey the chapter flow needs to be this and that's just everyone almost every executive has to use a ghostriter because

Mike Sarraille2:43:01

Eight eight eight hours if not 10 hours of the day I'm focused on the company but uh I do writing I do like writing I've always written uh even when I was in the military you know I used to journal about or or or reflect on the missions that we ran and what I've learned Yeah.

Uh always writing about leadership like somebody says something that's piffy and on point you're like boom writing my book.

Yeah. So uh it's also an outlet for for me to better understand, visualize and articulate certain leadership uh concepts or principles that then I can step onto a conference stage and deliver in a way and translate in a way that if I'm speaking to let's say a manufacturing uh industry conference that I can relate it to them, not some military concept that that they'll be like what I don't see how that translates. that's been the the fuel or the success point that I can take a military story and then say, "Let me tell you how this translates into your profession, your industry, and your business model." Interesting.

Mike Sarraille2:44:44

I feel like a bit narcissistic. So, and I went to like there there were these speaking forums.

Mike Sarraille2:44:51

Where they bring in all these speakers and and and I learned some things, but I I am not the animated guy. I'm not the uh the the loud guy, the hands guy. I think when you come in with authenticity,

Yeah. and and you're you can relate to the people in a way that you know you've you've been in the business world, you've been in all these domains and be like

Mike Sarraille2:45:14

I've been and arguably I can I can say that I'm still at.

Mike Sarraille2:45:18

And and if you think your problems are unique, I assure you they're not. Whether you're in in manufacturing or investment banking, every single problem you have res revolves around people, fuel, process, and systems

And and in deliver in a way that resonates with them without being overly performative. Yeah.

You know, they they want you to stay in like a box. You can only take three steps this way. Three steps this way. I'm like, "No, I walk."

Mike Sarraille2:45:44

I'm like, I'm not going to be like every other speaker. I'm going to do what works for me. And if it doesn't resonate with the audience, like I get we put a QR code on uh up at the end of every speech and I tell people I'm gonna follow what I preach.

Tell me what you liked. Tell me what you would change. And we read every single one.

And um I mean the insight I get from the people in the audience like, "Oh, I love how you explain this. Hey, would have loved if you dived a little deeper into this concept or translated it in a different way." Boom. We're going to we're going to adapt that in into the next speech. And and the other thing too is

Some people will create a system. I've got a system. I call it evolve leadership.

Mike Sarraille2:46:24

Um first four letters of evolve spelled backwards are love. And so I talk about again standards and accountability the highest form of love. um but uh they want to give the same cookie cutter speech and so that may work for the company but yeah every single speech I give is curated to what their objectives are for that conference or that meeting

Completely different decks so we use what I call uh every single deck is the throwaway is that after I give it to Acme company y

At this conference it's done now are there things I can take or general themes yes but we do a completely new deck so no deck I ever do because I use presentations is ever the same for any any speech.

Mike Sarraille2:47:30

I appreciate that. I just need to get the my my family to uh to Franklin or Brentwood. Let's go.

Mike Sarraille2:47:36

See me more uh more often.