Episode · Mar 13, 2026 · 1 hr 13 min
AI, Politics, and a Shot at the White House
with Andrew Yang
Andrew Yang is an entrepreneur who ran for president and now works to lower mobile phone bills through Noble Mobile.
Summary
Andrew tells Ken that meeting former presidents helped him see the office as a job ordinary people could do, which pushed him to run. He built a campaign from outside the political establishment, raised about $40 million, made seven debate stages, and used independent media to reach voters. He describes falling trust in government, the limits of the two-party system, and why he warned that automation could displace millions of workers before the country was ready.
The conversation then turns to Noble Mobile, which Yang says grew from the high wireless bills many people accept without question. He explains why phone service has become an overpriced commodity and how a lower bill can free up money while less screen time can help families. Ken and Yang compare rules they set for their children around phones, social media, and online safety. Yang also talks about building a business that tries to solve a practical problem instead of waiting for politics to fix it.
Show notes
Andrew Yang joins me for a conversation about politics, AI, entrepreneurship, and why he believed he had to run for president.
We talk about what pushed him from the private sector into national politics, what he learned from meeting former presidents, and why he came away convinced that the people leading the country are not superhuman. Andrew opens up about the reality of running a presidential campaign, from building a team and raising roughly $40 million to making seven debate stages and breaking through with independent media.
We also get into the deeper issues driving his campaign: collapsing trust in government, the two-party trap, insider corruption, and the very real threat AI poses to millions of jobs. Andrew explains why he’s been sounding the alarm on automation for years and why he believes the country still has not caught up to what’s coming.
From there, we shift into Noble Mobile and the simple idea behind it: most Americans are getting crushed on wireless bills and barely question it. Andrew breaks down how Noble works, why phone service has become an overpriced commodity, and how reducing costs and screen time can both improve people’s lives.
This is a conversation about ambition, common sense, broken systems, and trying to build something better instead of just complaining about what’s broken.
For more information about Noble Mobile, head to noblemobile.com
Transcript
Made from YouTube's automatic captions and lightly corrected, so a few words and names may be off. Click a time to play the video from there.
Ken Rideout
Andrew Yang, thanks for doing this, man. I am so proud to be your friend and proud of you. Like you're the most dynamic person I know.
Andrew Yang
Are you kidding me? [ __ ] man. I mean, you'd run my ass into the ground five ways on Sunday. So, right back at you. Congratulations on the book. I know a lot of people have been waiting to read it.
Ken Rideout
Thank you, brother. And about the running, if I had your money, I wouldn't have to run so much.
Andrew Yang
Tell my wife that that's why I'm slowing down. I'm sluggish.
Ken Rideout
You are the furthest thing from sluggish. You're all in on Noble Mobile, which we'll come back to, but I really want to start with the presidential campaign, which is what most people know you about outside of like the tech world. And I'm just curious like what the hell convinced you that you could run for president? Like I This is what I love about you. It's so audacious. You're like, "Yeah, I'm going to run for president." Like you won't maybe start with like local mayor, senator, state rep.
Nope, I want to be the president.
Andrew Yang
Yes, and that's why this is from the White House and I'm president today. Now, um part of it, Ken, was I met a couple of the former presidents, uh George W. Bush, Barack Obama. Have you met any of these characters?
Ken Rideout
Unfortunately, no.
Andrew Yang
Cuz
Ken Rideout
But I have huge admiration for the office and like I just think it's what's happening the last several cycles of like people publicly dumping on the president is it's sad to me cuz I'm like, "Dude, they're our leader, whether you like it or not." It's like being on a the Olympic hockey team and you don't like the captain. So, you're like, "I hate this team." Then get off of it.
Andrew Yang
I'm with you that um the diminution of respect for the office is not a good thing. Um but I met Barack Obama multiple times when he was president. Um met George W. Bush, met Bill Clinton. And when I met them, I did not come away thinking, "Wow, these guys are some otherworldly uh hu like you know, superhumans." Uh was like, oh, these guys are just like you and me and
For better or worse. So, when you ask what got me to run for president, one was a meeting governors, senators, presidents, et cetera, and just being, okay, like, you know, and you've had this experience, I know, where you've met people, soldiers, athletes, fighters, you know, different people, and they have like a vibe or an energy to them. CEOs,
Yeah. Entrepreneurs very often.
These political types do, too, and it did not make me think, oh, they're somehow better than me in various respects. This was particularly true. I remember watching the 2016 presidential debates, where I was watching Trump stomp on everyone, honestly, and
Ken Rideout
God. What a drubbing. I mean, he trounced them.
Andrew Yang
And and I looked up
Ken Rideout
What are some of the weaknesses?
Andrew Yang
Yes. And I looked up and saw that field and was like, oh, man, like, I I felt like I was better than the vast majority of them. Part of it, too, and this is a distinction between you and me, maybe, but I also went to fancy schools with some of these characters, and so I definitely did not think, oh, they're somehow better, smarter than you or me. They're really not.
I don't know if that message is welcome.
No, but it's the truth.
Yeah.
Ken Rideout
I think that a lot of times people will be like ask me, how did you connect with these people? I said, the first thing that I wasn't not doing was trying to connect with people. Like, like meeting you. It's an honor for me to meet you. I never thought like, I'm going to meet Andrew Yang. I'm like doing the best that I can to in my life, and we can and we cross paths, and I'm like, I love this guy. He's got great energy, even if we don't agree on everything politically, I still love and respect everything about what you're doing.
It's like I have huge respect, and like you said, you went to fancy schools. I think sometimes that's like almost frowned upon. He had everything handed to him. Like, no, I wish that I could be so successful that my kids could go to fancy schools. That's the American dream. But then when we see someone experiencing the American dream, we're like, "F them. They didn't have They had it easy." Like, your parents did a good job and created that life for you. Like, you something to be proud of, but a lot of times it's in comes with a negative connotation.
Andrew Yang
Well, I am Asian, so definitely my my parents were like, "You better get into good schools."
I appreciate that perspective, Ken, but I will say that I think the reverse is true, too, where I grew up in a town in Upstate New York with um Italian-American kids uh whose dads were contractors and police officers and and the rest of it. And maybe it's cuz I was born in the, you know, '70s and like that there were um fewer TV networks or or whatnot. Um but it felt like we're all in it together. You know what I mean? And And when I was like a skinny Chinese-American kid, I just wanted to be picked for the teams and [ __ ] like that.
You know what I mean? So like I when I was growing up, it was like, "Oh, like I'm trying to fit in." And um and so [snorts] that spirit never left me. Like, you know, it's like I think one of the problems in this country is that people who maybe attend certain schools or do certain jobs think that they're better than other people. And like I just never had that sense.
Ken Rideout
Yeah, but I think that that personality type doesn't necessarily happen at elite schools or bad schools. Like that If you take a cross-section of all the schools, you'll get the same personality types. You'll get overachievers, you'll get idiots.
Andrew Yang
You get those irritating guys no matter what it yeah, it's the
Ken Rideout
And the point I was going to make about about meeting all these people and having these different relationships. Like with The Rock left me a voice memo once on Instagram. It's like to your point I I say this to people all the time. Every We're all the same.
Andrew Yang
Yeah, yeah.
Ken Rideout
Some I had said to someone, "I'll talk to anyone who buys my book." I've got like 500 people like, "When can we talk?" And I'm like, "I'm shocked people want to talk to me." And I asked one guy, "Out of curiosity, what do you want to talk about?" He's like, "You're an inspiration for me." And blah blah. And I was like, "Man, I'm oblivious. I don't see myself the way maybe other people see me. So, I don't know if you experience that where you're like, people, especially after running for president, people come up to you like, Andrew, let me get a picture.
And it's a little bit like, you know who I am? Do you ever experience that of like, whoa.
Andrew Yang
Uh dude, my my um book is called uh Hey Yang, where is my thousand bucks? Uh trying to relate that experience cuz I've gotten that. The alternate title was, hey, am I racist or are you Andrew Yang?
Ken Rideout
That would have been a good one.
Andrew Yang
Which I've also gotten. Um so, people come up to me on the street all the time. Um mainly with uh like excitement and uh happiness. And I what's funny is that even though it's happened to me now thousands and thousands of times, uh to your point, each time I'm surprised.
I'm like, oh, [ __ ] you recognized me? Like, dope. Yeah, sure, happy to.
Ken Rideout
It's flattering, but it's also sometimes like overwhelming where I'm like, yeah, yeah, I can't believe like someone will be like, hey, you were on my flight. I didn't want to interrupt you. I'm like, why didn't you should have said hello?
Andrew Yang
That's a little bit of a thing when like you realize that people noticed you without doing anything and you thought you were unnoticed.
Ken Rideout
Yeah. Oh, for sure. A lot.
Andrew Yang
That's a thing.
Ken Rideout
The other thing I want to say is you you mentioned about growing up in the 70s. I I was born in '71 growing up in inner-city Boston. And like we were in a segregated neighborhood. Like we were in like white Irish Catholic and Italian. But I mean, I had a couple black kids that like were in our circles, but it was like wouldn't be uncommon for like people to be throwing around N-word. It was like segregated. And it was like when I was really young is when they had that um desegregation and the bus forced the bussing, which was insane.
They were forcing black kids into white neighborhoods to just to go to school and vice versa. And it was just like even as a little kid, I'm like, why do I care if a black kid comes to school here? It was crazy, but I always have great I don't know if empathy is the right word, but respect for anyone that grew up in those times cuz like kids that are growing up now that might be Chinese, Indian, black, Hispanic, they don't know the struggles of a Chinese kid in the 70s in a white neighborhood.
Like that did the bullying was real. This was real racism, right? So when I see meet people like you that have gone through that and come out like so successful, I'm like kudos to that the kids today will never appreciate the level of bullying and and horrible behavior from some people back in the 70s and even earlier.
Andrew Yang
Um I have a chapter on that in in the book about um all sorts [snorts] of things that happened to me in grade school and I just see it as part of the culture at that time and uh you know, it does toughen you up. You know, honestly I I look at my kids today and I'm just like shaking my head. And by the way, I'm like trying to get a read around what their experience is like in terms of being Asian today and it's a totally different world.
Ken Rideout
It's like it's like we're on a different planet. If you made a disparaging comment about someone's race now, like you might be kicked out of school. Back then it was like I wouldn't be surprised if the teachers were doing it. It was crazy.
Andrew Yang
This is one thing I'm actually curious about again because if you we just parachuted into a random school in Iowa or Montana or Nebraska, is it like when you and I grew up still or are they I just don't know. I like I
Ken Rideout
Not a chance. There was like I I thought it was much more hostile and aggressive when I was a kid. Now it's like look at someone sideways, like here's an example. So we moved from I lived in New York I grew up in Boston, lived in New York 20 years, then lived in LA for 5 years and I had four kids and they were really like kind of little kids in LA and then we moved to Nashville. And my daughter is adopted. She's Ethiopian. And for a long time she really struggled with not being adopted, just being different.
She She didn't like being different and I you can understand. But never ever a hint of any kind of racism. But when we when the kids are little, I'm like, "Listen." Talk Tell them my boys like, "Hey, if someone's not being nice to you" You know, issues would come up. I'm like, "If someone's not being nice to you, in this house, we're going to ask them nicely three times. Hey, I Please stop doing that. Please stop doing this." And I'm like, "After the third time, crack them if you have to." My wife is like looking at me like I'm crazy.
And And my my oldest son was like, "Well, what if someone puts their hands on you?" I said, "Oh, after that, there's no talking. As soon as someone puts their hands on you, you're They're trying to hurt you. You're not having a fight. It's not a um a a a contest like a fair sports thing. They're trying to hurt you. Like, you need to be aggressive." And of course, my wife pulls me aside and is like, "You realize we live in Brentwood, Tennessee. There hasn't been a fight here since the '70s.
No one's having fights in school." And I was like, "In my school, it would wouldn't be uncommon to see a fight every single day."
Andrew Yang
Yeah.
Ken Rideout
And so, that's a huge difference right there. The The level of oversight I mean, obviously, you see all the [ __ ] on the internet where kids are getting picked on and bullied. And those Those incidents get highlighted. But, most part, I feel like this is like we are in the Fabergé egg era where everyone's a Fabergé egg, including their feelings. And I always tell my kids, "If someone hurt your feelings, you're responsible for your feelings. I don't owe you anything." Like, is it If If If someone's just hurting your feelings to be rude, okay, then that's a different thing.
But, if you get offended or your feelings are hurt from someone else's opinions or way of life, like, deal with it. They're not responsible. You're responsible for your own feelings. And that's a big difference that I've seen now is like the school wants to be responsible for everyone's feelings.
Andrew Yang
Yeah, I'm I'm with you where if kids learn to take responsibility for how they react, then that that's the best kind of training they can get. And I one of the problems in American life, in my opinion, now is that we hold administrators or teachers responsible for things that, in my opinion, are out of their control.
Ken Rideout
100%. Yeah.
Andrew Yang
And then we wonder you know, you get pissed off, you get frustrated. It's like oh, they they didn't do this or that. Maybe part of it's I've run businesses and you kind of know what a business can and can't do. You kind of know what a teacher can and can't do or like you know, a principal. I mean, we often By the way, this is true in politics, too. I know it's like we're joking cuz you know, we're doing this in New York City and whenever there's like a giant pile of snow, you can like make a joke, be like oh, [ __ ] Zoran, [ __ ] mayor, what's with this snow?
You know, it's it's like oh, like he's got like magic
Ken Rideout
No, I
Andrew Yang
Powers to whisk away snow. Um so it it it's like you know, we we do that in politics all the time. Like the new team takes power and then all of a sudden things are their fault. And part of me is like, dude, they're still trying to find like the the office equipment. You know, they just like moved into this freaking place and then you're like oh, like the
Ken Rideout
And he has no political experience. So he's going to have team around him that he he basically has no choice in a lot of cases. He he can pick who it is, but like he's being advised by people that have to have experience. And the truth is, anyone that's worked in the system, like nothing seems to work efficiently. Like the subways run and stuff, but it seems like if you ran your business the way some of these municipalities run there you you would be the municipality would be bankrupt in 12 months.
Andrew Yang
Well, so um some numbers for you that I think your audience will enjoy in particular and this will be fun. Um what is the approval rating of US Congress do you think right now percentage wise?
Ken Rideout
Zero, I would be shocked because the the childishness and the lockdowns and the in fighting is embarrassing. They should not be allowed to leave that freaking chamber until things are sorted to a certain extent. The fact that they like take these recesses and on huge outstanding issues, president can't get people nominated for either party.
Andrew Yang
Yeah, yeah, totally.
Ken Rideout
It's so disheartening.
Andrew Yang
It's close to zero. It's 15% 15. Very, very low. What do you think the re-election rate is for incumbent members of Congress?
Ken Rideout
It's got to be astronomical 99%.
Andrew Yang
It's like 94%. So you have 15% approval, 94% re-election. And that's why everyone's so ticked off. You're looking at being like, okay, why won't things change? Um but what they've done is they've created a system where our happiness, what what we want, um is more or less irrelevant in 90% of these races.
Ken Rideout
Not only that, they're basically committing essentially crimes right in front of us with insider trading. There's no shame in it at all. It's like how how can you can just look at their trades and you're like, how is are we above this?
Andrew Yang
People have made killings on just following their trades, you know, they're like entire
Ken Rideout
Buddy, I'm in one of them.
I'm in one of them, the Pelosi tracker on unusual whales. I have some small money tied to these trackers. And I don't even need to know what the stock is. I'm like, listen,
Andrew Yang
Shout out to unusual whales. They do good work.
Ken Rideout
These people these some of these, to your point, when you meet them, you're like, there's nothing dynamic going on here. And I and I to be if I'm being honest, I view them as puppets to the lobbyists. So they're like owned by, you know, these people have joked like they should wear a NASCAR shirt with all their sponsors on it because it's the truth. And you see them voting for things that clearly go against the people's interest, but they're in a but the without the lobby, they don't get reelected.
It's all money, right? I mean, you know from running for president. Did you run up against that of like, how am I ever going to raise enough money to make a dent? And part two, when you were running, did you in your mind think, "Okay, I'm not going to win, but I could get an important cabinet job if I build enough momentum that the my voters would carry weight and maybe I could be some big secretary and then work my way up?"
Andrew Yang
Yeah, um if you remember the centerpiece of my campaign, it was that AI was going to come and take the jobs and we should just start distributing buying power quickly and broadly, which by the way is aging phenomenally well. Give me the I don't know if you've seen what's going on with um AI and
Ken Rideout
I don't live under a rock, Andrew. I know what's going on.
Andrew Yang
Um so, I I wanted to be the Paul Revere of AI and automation saying, you know, the robots are coming, essentially. Um the magic words are from the future. Oh, yeah, they're here now. Uh and so, that was the mission. I didn't think I was going to wind up president on the first try. Uh I wanted to mainstream solutions, um what I call the freedom dividend, which was giving everyone money, which excuse me, uh in my mind is more and more common sense and and inevitable because AI is going to shred millions and millions of white-collar jobs.
It's going to make a college degree useless in a lot of contexts.
Ken Rideout
They almost are now. I mean, unless you're studying engineering, medicine, law, something very specific. If you're studying like me, sociology, like save the money.
Andrew Yang
Dude, it gets even worse where I'm friends with uh partners of law firms and they're having AI write their legal briefs and said, "If I gave uh junior associate this task, would have taken them days, they would have done a worse job. I give it to the models. I actually they give it to three models.
Yeah. They have them each take a crack. They're done in 15 minutes and then they just take the best pieces of each, conform. The whole process takes them 90 minutes. And so then they're thinking, why do I need to hire some law school grad and pay them six figures to learn on my dime? So it's it's rough and it's just going to get much much rougher.
Ken Rideout
Yeah, and the other thing that's crazy is like who's writing the code for these AI models? Like I said, the the I think because of the disapproval rating or the low approval rating of our elected officials, we're getting this whipsaw effect where you're getting an extreme like I don't care what your political sway leanings are. You get an extreme like what people they would describe Trump as an extreme right-wing like maniac. I don't agree with that, but then you could also get this like Gavin Newsom is like a candidate like if you if he was running on his record in California, you'd be like, I wouldn't hire this guy to like answer the phones.
Nothing is going seems to be going right there. It's mass exodus. Everything seems to be not working. And because of this you get okay, we got to get Trump out. We're going to vote for an extreme like left-wing. Okay, he's not good. Let us who's the next one we can get that that is extreme on the other side. We're not getting any centrist that have like common sense solutions [clears throat] that can bring anyone together. And then the whole agenda of the opposing party, whoever loses is to just not focus on policy and and and and topics, but to tear the other guy down.
All the effort is in tearing the other candidate down.
Andrew Yang
Yeah, what what I say is we're playing you lose or the parties are playing you lose I lose you lose I lose while we're all collectively doing the losing. We're all looking up being like, what the hell's going on? What are you guys doing?
Ken Rideout
Do you think this is a scenario where someone could run like yourself who just comes in as like, listen, I'm an independent. This whole the whole idea of two parties is crazy. What if I'm like, listen, I agree with some of the some of the the policies here and I agree with some of these policies, but at the end of the day, we have to run this like a business to a certain extent. We can't lose money. And if we just keep printing money, we're only hurting ourselves, and that's the part that most people don't realize.
Andrew Yang
Well, Ken, uh I 100% think that there's a wide-open lane for someone, uh particularly as about half of Americans now say we're independent. Uh the approval rating of both parties is record low. The Democrats are down to I'm a numbers guy, so you can tell but the Democratic approval rating's under 29%, lowest generations. Republicans not much better, it's 32%. So, uh you have this freaking wellspring of tens of millions of Americans who are fed up. 2/3 don't think uh either party represents them. Um so, I think someone is going to take that opportunity, uh and I probably know them, uh or maybe even like look at them in the mirror.
Ken Rideout
Because I guess that's what I'm getting at is like I hope that you look at this and realize like someone with common sense who can get up and be like listen, don't don't ask me to badmouth anyone else. I'm only focusing on what I can do. But the but with the advent of Trump, you have this this environment where the more you can zing and burn and dump on the other person, it's like a win, whereas like you remember was was it Barack Obama? Who was he debating where it was like super civil?
Was it Romney? And they were just completely like super kind to each other, but getting their points across. I was like I don't care what you think about the politicians or about the parties, but can't we get back to a time or can we get back to a time where people like listen, agree to disagree respectfully. Here's what I think we should be doing.
Andrew Yang
Yeah, and I I think that's one reason why you have to get beyond the blue versus red um dichotomy, because if you look at the Democratic base, uh they want to exact revenge essentially on Trump and and his and his folks. And look, uh in my case, I mean, I have always thought that Trump was kind of a an accelerant to the uh like dysfunction of various institutions. I don't blame people who voted for him though, because if if you look at the choices at that point, I mean, you had Joe Biden who royally screwed up on the border and was not having a fun four years or something.
Ken Rideout
Felt intentional.
Andrew Yang
Oh, yeah, sure. Like mismanaged.
Ken Rideout
Yeah.
Andrew Yang
Um the the border and then Kamala And so if you have this two-sided choice, like I don't blame anyone for choosing really either side. What we need is more than two choices and then you'd have And by the way, I mean, everyone listening to this um like no one would have put those two as like the top two choices you know, to run a business or the country. Uh there are all sorts of very very patriotic, [snorts] remarkable folks that you and I know that by the way, I when I talk to business leaders, I joke it's like, "Hey, I don't even know you guys that well.
I would choose you to run this
Ken Rideout
I always think, "Why don't we hire a president
Like where we have to actually recruit someone like a really successful business leader. The guy at Microsoft is impressive. I mean, take the political leanings out of it. Like I don't care which party, but someone who's like run something super successful or someone who's built something. Someone like yourself that's built something and and has experience managing people and being responsible for a budget, not a politician whose only job has been in politics. What do you know about the world? And they talk about what their constituents wants.
These people live in like a bubble. They're like they're literally trading stocks on inside information and think it's the norm. It it they're so detached from real life.
Andrew Yang
You know, one of my top draft picks for this is Mark Cuban who I'm friends with.
Ken Rideout
I love Mark Cuban. I don't agree with everything he says, but I appreciate his hustle and his like hey, he believes what he believes and I can get behind that.
Andrew Yang
Yeah, he's a builder. He started a company called Cost Plus Drugs.
Ken Rideout
I one of of greatest companies ever. I love it.
Andrew Yang
Totally. And he
Ken Rideout
How everyone doesn't use it is like the greatest mystery in the world.
Andrew Yang
Yes. If if you want your drugs, go to Cost Plus Drugs. Um but Mark saw that Americans were getting screwed and gouged on prescription drugs and then thought, "You know what? I can build a business that improves that." Um his business was actually an inspiration for Noble Mobile um because I thought, "Well, shoot. Uh what Mark's doing is genius. And is there anything all Americans spend money on that we can get them a better value on?" Um because when you look at Americans today, and you know, I came to fame in 2020 saying robots are coming, but also saying like we have to make the economy work better for people.
You look at our our costs, uh they all keep creeping up and up in a way that maybe our paychecks aren't, and it's making us more and more frustrated and angry. So, what Mark's doing is trying to get the cost down. And uh with Noble Mobile, um and people I I'd love to unpack the math because people will be like, "Oh, wireless is not that big a deal." Um the average American is spending 83 a month on their wireless bill. I was spending twice that. I was spending like 150 on Verizon.
Ken Rideout
Same.
Andrew Yang
Yeah, same, right? And you know, everyone listening to this again is like, "Oh, that's just what it costs, and it's not that big a deal." The average European is spending 35 a month um for the same stuff, by the way. And so, if you have a difference of even $50 uh a month * 12 is $600 * the whatever 40 years you're going to be a customer, that'd be 24,000, then you put an interest rate on that and compound that, you're looking at 40 to 50,000.
You're essentially giving Verizon a car, a nice one, too, or a down payment on a house uh over your time as their customer. Um so, when I I looked at this math, the total spend, by the way, the extra wireless spend um is 100 billion a year is what Americans are spending on our wireless uh versus you you Europeans or some other uh developed country. And of that 100 billion, 11 billion's going to Verizon in shareholder dividends, 7 billion's going to AT&T in shareholder dividends. Talk about the the, you know, like the stock trading and the rest of it.
So, you have these mega corps extracting billions of dollars from the American population, giving it to shareholders. It's better to be a shareholder than a customer of these outfits.
And so, then I looked at this picture and said, "Okay, can I do what Mark did and get Americans a better deal?" And so, I went to Verizon, AT&T, and T-Mobile and said, "Hey guys, I'm trying to get Americans a better deal. Like, you know, um do you guys want want to work something out?" And the carrier that wanted to work something out was T-Mobile. Um I was actually just in Seattle last week meeting with um the executive team there. Uh and so, we licensed T-Mobile's network for Noble Mobile, and we can cut the average Americans wireless bill in half um to about 41, 42 dollars a month for truly unlimited.
Uh you know, you can go hog wild. And Ken, let me say that I'm a heavy phone user. I use my phone up the wazoo.
The most I can pay is 50, so I'm already saving 100 bucks a month um relative to Verizon uh individually. Um but if I don't use all of the data in a given month, then Noble will send me the cash back um as a reward. So, not only can we save the average American money, we also give you a reward for using less screen time. And I don't know if if you and I have gotten into this, but um most Americans now realize that our phones are making us uh a little crazy.
Uh you know, they make us feel more angry.
Ken Rideout
I've I've got a whole rant on this when you're done.
Andrew Yang
So, Noble reduces the average user screen time by 17%, um which is, you know, like something. Um and it lowers your phone bill by on average, um, you know, uh, 40 or 50 bucks a month. Um, so we've been growing like mad and, uh, it's fun to be able to solve a problem that every American feels, even if most of us haven't woken up to it yet, the same way we've woken up to, for example, cable companies. Like we all turned on cable and like cut the cord.
Ken Rideout
Cut them. I got rid of them. Actually, because of you, I got rid of AT&T and everything and went what and like full disclosure, I met you, you told me about Noble Mobile, what we're talking about right now and I was like, I want to invest. So I'm an investor in Noble Mobile purely because I love the I love the mission. I transferred my phone number just so I don't want this to sound like an ad, but it's the truth, which is why I want to talk to you about it.
It's like same with Cuban, like such a great idea. I can't believe it took this long for someone to do this. I had AT&T. I was paying $100 a month for unlimited data. If I went to Europe, it was $10 a day, but I didn't get refunded for the domestic data data I wasn't using. I just got an extra $10 in Europe or wherever I was in the world, which at the time I was like, what a great deal. I'm here for a week. Okay, extra 70.
So now my bill's 170 a month. I didn't think anything of it. To your point, I use my phone a ton. I travel a lot. Never really think to connect it to Wi-Fi cuz I'm on unlimited data. When I switched to Noble Mobile, first of all, it took me like, I would say honestly 7 minutes and my bill went to fixed bill at 50 and the first month I got $19 back and I'm a power user of my phone. Like I don't even look at the screen time because I I don't want I don't want to get stressed.
I was like looking at my Whoop sleep data. When I know I didn't sleep good, I'm like, I'm not going to look. It's going to make me feel even worse.
Andrew Yang
Yeah.
Ken Rideout
So not only did I have my phone, I have six people in my house. I have a wife, and four kids, and while to your point about the phones making you crazy, we have just recently told the kids, you're not using the phone for anything other than like you can sign it out during They take it to school so that we can reach them, but we brick the phone with this device called Brick and it shuts off everything except the phone and the text and I'm telling you it makes a difference in their personality, their demeanor.
If my kids are allowed to use this on the weekend, let's say 30 minutes, I tell my uh 12-year-old son like, all right, buddy, time's up on the iPad. This is a mild-mannered, nice kid. Couple times he just gets up and throws the iPad on the ground. I'm like, I will throw you out the effing window. Don't you ever Yeah, you're not using for But the point is that he gets so triggered. It's literally like taking crack from a crack addict.
Andrew Yang
Yeah.
Ken Rideout
If he doesn't get on it, we This doesn't happen. If I tell him no, he doesn't act crazy. If I give it to him and then take it back even if we have a predetermined time limit, it's it's it's seriously a psychological issue. So, I've cut everyone in the house, so six people. My wife had like some family plan for like $300, $350 on AT&T all you can use for all the phones. Now, everyone in the house has Noble Mobile. It's $300 fixed and I told the kids, whatever you save on your phone, you get That's your allowance.
So, if you save 20 bucks, and I said, you know, you can also save by being on Wi-Fi and not using data. So, when you're in the house, it automatically connects. So, what are the chances that they're streaming when they're out? They'll They're 10 to Yeah, 10 to 15 years old. So, they're all getting 20 or 30 bucks a month in dividends from Noble Mobile and it's I'm telling you it's been a game-changer. And again, I don't want this to sound like a giant ad, but it is.
Like, this is like a real game-changer and it like the most common sense thing. And what I think and what I hope happens is eventually Starlink provides cell to satellite service, acquires Noble Mobile and all their subscribers and we're the first people on the Starlink network cuz that's what's next. Like, these wireless companies I think are in a real jam. No one's going to get satellites up there like Starlink.
Andrew Yang
Yeah, that These wireless companies you know, I I now study the business pretty closely and um they're having a hard time growing because everyone has a connection. And by the way, so if you were a company, let's say you you're a publicly traded company and you have to show growth, what are you going to do? You're going to raise prices.
Ken Rideout
Of course.
Andrew Yang
So there there was like this Verizon promo recently where there where they were like, "Hey, join now and we'll fix your price for 2 years." Which is like, "Wait a minute. That means if I don't join now, you're going to raise my prices?"
Ken Rideout
God forbid they look at cost cutting or creating efficiencies internally. They just like, "How do we gouge the That's what everyone's doing." There was some study recently came out and it was like DoorDash. I don't want to say DoorDash, but one of those delivery services and I don't remember which
Andrew Yang
Dude, my Uber bill just freaking shot up. It like it used to be like getting in a car and be like, "Yeah, no big deal. 12 bucks." Whatever. And all of a sudden I'm like, "Wait, what's going on?"
Ken Rideout
But those But this is true. So one of the companies they got internal documents were leaked where they're like, "Yeah, add the five like for $5 extra we'll expedite." And it didn't do anything. It was just like a psychological
Andrew Yang
Yeah.
Ken Rideout
But are you like, "These are the people that we're trusting?" It felt like a political thing where I'm like, "This is what they think of us. They think we're nitwits." They're like the These food delivery systems are just like charge them extra, tell them we're hustling, and then be like, "Yeah, that was the hustle price." You You know what I mean? It was the same exact thing.
Andrew Yang
Yeah, I'm important. I'm special. Hustle, hustle. Five bucks, five bucks.
Andrew Yang
I want to dig into something you said cuz the same thing happened to me. You go abroad on Verizon or AT&T they charge you 10 or 12 bucks a day. Um it cost them only $2 to put you on a foreign carrier's network for that day. So why they charging you 10 or 12? Nobody knows.
Ken Rideout
Cuz they have dividends to pay and shareholders to impress so they can keep their $50 million CEO role.
Andrew Yang
Yes, and cuz so we're kind of chumps so we're like oh 10 bucks a day, whatever.
Ken Rideout
Doesn't sound that bad.
Andrew Yang
It doesn't sound that bad but then it adds up um and then like you said your home bill stays the same. Um so you know when I did that my phone bill was literally don't judge me everyone but it was like you know almost $400 and I I've talked to families that had multiple lines where it was even higher. Um and so uh we're just trying to apply common sense business practices where it's like wait, why would I charge like 12 bucks if I'm paying two?
Thing things like that. Um and uh we can rationalize an industry that we all use every day. It's a little bit like oxygen I joke because um you know but we have these we're just overpaying for a commodity.
Ken Rideout
Well, think about it. Name another product that every single person that you know I I would I've never met someone who doesn't have a phone. That means every single person. So you were using cost plus drugs. What if I'm healthy and I don't use prescription drugs? Doesn't matter who you are. You use a phone. I promise you. So this is something we all have and it's just become the norm. It's It's kind of funny, right? Like when I started working I didn't have a cell phone.
I had a calling card like I could use from the company that I could use from a payphone. And now that's happened so quickly. So, when people think about AI and the robots, to your earlier point, oh, that sounds like science fiction. If someone told you and I when we were in high school, you're going to have this little tiny, like, note card-sized thing that's going to do everything. It's going to be your Walkman. It's going to be your navigation tool. It's going to replace the Remember when you had the maps in the car with a highlighter?
Andrew Yang
Yeah, I remember.
Ken Rideout
People My kids can't even comprehend that you had to, like, know where you were going. It's just wild.
Andrew Yang
I tell my kids about um cassette uh players and CDs, and they're just like, what? That sounds Stone Age ridiculous. And I was like, when CDs came out, it was the biggest deal ever. My car got a CD player. I was like, I was in the Space Age.
Ken Rideout
Dude, I remember having an eight-track player in my uh first Cadillac uh coupe uh Sedan DeVille. It was like a '79. It had eight-track in eight-track. When's the last time you even saw an eight-track tape?
Andrew Yang
It's been a minute, but we definitely had a collection of eight-tracks uh in the living room. My my parents would get whatever the heck they were getting. Um you know, my parents were so cute, man. They they tried to make my brother and I more American, so they would like bring back random cassette tapes being like, listen to this. Like, this'll help you. So, you know,
They'd like might bring back Michael Jackson Thriller, which is great. Like, I thought that, you know, that that was dope. Um they'd bring back stuff like that, just being, this'll help you guys understand uh America.
Ken Rideout
To I have so much respect for your parents without even knowing them. I want to I want to just go back for a minute and talk about like, did they move from China to the US?
Andrew Yang
Um so, they came over as students from Taiwan.
Ken Rideout
Okay.
Andrew Yang
Which, you know, is a lovely place. Um I I visited there last year. I'm a bit of a folk hero there, too. It's nice.
Ken Rideout
Oh, nice.
Andrew Yang
Yeah, yeah. My nickname there was Pride of Taiwan. It was like, sweet.
Ken Rideout
Dude, that's awesome. But, the point I want to get to is like, people don't like think about moving your Even if they came as students, but moving as like a married couple or an adult to a foreign country where you're like, very foreign. And now you're going to raise your kids in not necessarily a place that's like, "Oh my god." Like if an American goes to like Taiwan or different parts of Europe and South America, they're like, "Oh, Americans are here." Especially if
Andrew Yang
And there's an international school, and you can chill, yeah.
Ken Rideout
But coming into a hostile place where people are kind of like they don't like you. You can feel like they don't
Andrew Yang
Very good, like, you know, I mean, my my dad's English
Ken Rideout
Respect.
Andrew Yang
Not so great. My mom My mom's English actually came along a lot cuz she was more industrious than my dad on that front. Um but yeah, man, I I appreciate and love my parents a great deal for taking the plunge, moving here, becoming immigrants. Uh and the American dream worked out for my brother and me. And really the question is whether it's going to work out for your kids and mine.
Ken Rideout
Yeah.
Andrew Yang
And, you know, that's like a very open question, unfortunately. You know, I mean, we're right now confidence in that is slipping.
Ken Rideout
No, but you know what I say? I have confidence in like I've I would never describe myself as arrogant, but I have confidence in I'm like, "Guys, we're going to figure it out." Like someone's going to win, and someone's going to lose. And that's the American way. It's like you It's It's available for you. That's what I love about this country, and that's what pisses me off about the current climate. It's like, "This is the best country in the world." You don't have to agree with all the policies, but you can essentially do anything here.
Andrew Yang
I mean
Ken Rideout
I mean you don't want to become You don't want to become a political activist and get targeted by the opposite party, but a person who isn't the average person, like, you can do anything. You can become anything. And if you have the resourcefulness and the intuition to apply to Ivy League schools, and you don't have the money, it's funny those Ivy League schools, you either have not enough money and they pay for everything, or you have a little too much money, and now you're on the hook for the 100 grand a year.
So, it's like feast or famine, but the if you show up at any of those schools and get accepted, they'll pay everything. Their endowment will cover everything.
Andrew Yang
Yeah, I mean, your your story is incredibly inspirational, uh Ken. Certainly for me, um running for president as an anonymous dude, uh and then uh, you know, making seven presidential debates and and raising So awesome. Uh, tens of millions of dollars. Um, I think you asked before it's like, "Hey, how did you tackle the system?" You know who I owe a great debt is independent um, voices like yourself. I mean, one of the single biggest activators for my presidential campaign was sitting with Joe Rogan in 2019.
Ken Rideout
Joe's the man.
Andrew Yang
Yeah, I mean, uh, you know, like I it was like a before Rogan and after Rogan in terms of the campaign.
So, um, you know, what and by the way, that independent media landscape is 10 times stronger now than it even was in 2019. It's one reason why I think an independent campaign would do really well now.
Ken Rideout
This is what I love about the current times with social media gets a bad rap, but I'm like, to the person that was struggling to be an actor and having to deal with casting couch and this and that. Now, you have an idea, you think you're creative, put it on YouTube. I promise you if it's good, they'll find you. The meaning the public. You don't need the system anymore. You don't need to go to a Hollywood studio and pander to a director. Make your own. The girl Issa Rae who did the show Insecure on HBO is the best example.
She had a YouTube channel like I think it was called Insecure Black Girls. So, she was just a creative, interesting girl, created enough content, enough buzz. Now she got a show on HBO, she's won acting awards, but it's like
Andrew Yang
You know there's another example of that. I have a chapter on him in my book cuz he and I are friendly is Shane Gillis.
Mhm.
Ken Rideout
So,
I love Shane Gillis.
Andrew Yang
{quote} {unquote} fired or canceled.
Goes and does his
Yeah, ends up just going out there, making a lot of internet content, too. Um, but then just shines on his own, uh, and it becomes so successful that SNL brings him back to host, much less be one of the random cast members. So, uh, to your point about, you know, America still being a place where you can make it happen. I mean,
Ken Rideout
Yeah.
Andrew Yang
Um, certainly you and I know folks who resemble that and I, I mean, we are that.
Ken Rideout
Yeah.
Andrew Yang
So, [snorts] at the time uh you know, I'm someone who wants to try and make it work for more people. And uh as a numbers guy, I can see one of my my jokes, but it's kind of true and false. It's like you shouldn't have to be remarkable to have like a
You know, like a uh a good life here in America. And unfortunately, I think it's becoming more and more the norm where it's like you you know, you you have to kind of have to be an outlier.
Ken Rideout
Remarkable might be a bit strong cuz I think if you're a super aggressive disciplined like you can make a lot of noise for yourself financially and professionally like with if you have the right mindset and the right attitude to show up and work hard. It's trying to dis trying to figure out which road to get on to start grinding. And a lot of times people like I want all those things. I just don't have the guidance or the wherewithal to know which I don't want to go 10 miles down this road and realize I just wasted all my time working for someone else.
Cuz I always say you're either working on making your own dreams come true or someone else's. And wasting your time working in a dead-end job like you need to have the kind of EQ to be like this guy's just using me for free labor like versus no, this guy's mentoring me and I can see a path to like leadership if you're working for someone else. But the this [clears throat] system is set up for people that work for themselves.
Andrew Yang
Yeah, yeah.
Ken Rideout
Look at the tax situation, everything. Self-employed
Andrew Yang
Owner owner-friendly.
Ken Rideout
They've become part of my routine. No hangover, no compromise. So, whether you're looking to buy online or in person, When you um decided to run for president, how much money did you raise and how was how did you find campaign managers and stuff like explain to me the earliest process?
Andrew Yang
Well, I I would love to and I I write about this a little bit, Ken, but check it out. Um there are only two rules to run for president. Do you know what they are?
Ken Rideout
Born in the um
Andrew Yang
Natural-born US citizen, that's right.
Ken Rideout
Natural-born and
Andrew Yang
35 years or older.
Ken Rideout
Oh, I was going to say age, but then I was like clearly it's not about being too old cuz we'll elect a dead person, but I
Andrew Yang
Yeah, yeah. No, you got it. I mean, they should have put a a upper limit. They didn't though.
Ken Rideout
There should be. I mean, why do we have people in their 80s making decisions for people in their 20s? Like At in 80, you've had a good run, man, but it's almost over. We're not No one's getting out of here.
Andrew Yang
I totally agree. Um so, you as you can tell, just about anyone technically can run for president and thousands of people do every cycle because in order to run for president, all you have to do is submit one sheet of paper saying I'm running for president. Uh then the next threshold is if you raise $10,000 or more, then you have to file paperwork with the FEC, which the vast majority of these people who filed the one sheet don't do.
Yeah.
So, um so, in my case, when I run, I assemble this tiny little ragtag band of folks who uh sign up to be my campaign manager and my comms person and my social media person. Um so, we're maybe like five or six of us. It's like a little startup at first. First announce uh does not take the world by storm. Um don't raise that much money. Um I put in a bit of money myself. Uh, and then we just started grinding. And then fast forward to 2020 and we've raised $40 million, made seven presidential debate stages.
Ken Rideout
Did you rally people on your team? Did you have PAC money?
Andrew Yang
So, what what's funny is, um, generally speaking, no. Um, but what's funny is when you get into the eight figures, when we raised $10 million or so, the consultants freaking come out of the woodwork just like, "Hey, hey, you know, we're we're here to uh film your ads. We're here to do your media strategy. We're here to do this." And And so, yeah, for a fee. They're like, you know, parasites. But you do need someone to uh film the ads and like uh buy the media time and, you know, you don't have experience doing that in Iowa or New Hampshire or wherever you're doing this.
So, you have to sift through the consultants and figure out, "Okay, which of the these people is not a joker? Which of these people like da da da?" And, you know, And so, you end up hiring some of the vendors. Um, and we did have a PAC of folks who just tried to raise a lot of money um for the campaign. Uh, I'll give you an example. So, Dave Chappelle ended up supporting my campaign.
Ken Rideout
Chappelle. I'm at a Jake Paul fight with um Dustin Poirier.
Andrew Yang
[ __ ] yeah. So, um so, Dave ended up doing shows for the campaign
Ken Rideout
Oh, wow.
Andrew Yang
Uh in Iowa and just donated all the money to uh the PAC. Because what happened was that was like a lot of money and there's like uh there's an individual contribution limit to the campaign directly of, let's call it, 3,000 a head. So, because David just raised six figures, whatever, he was like, "Hey, it it goes to the PAC." So, we had a PAC on that level, which is just, you know, a a political action committee that was not coordinating with the campaign that was buying ad time.
Ken Rideout
Yeah.
Andrew Yang
So, we had that sort of thing, but that was still just grassroots donors.
Ken Rideout
Okay, so, you do all that. Like, fast forward to now you getting on the you're like, hey Andrew, you're good. You're on the debate stage with the uh you're like now like
Andrew Yang
Now you're Joe Biden etc.
Ken Rideout
Now you're in the race. Like to me that's when you see the person on stage with the other people you're like those are the candidates. Someone just being like I'm running is like okay.
Andrew Yang
Obviously who the who the uh never going to hear about again.
Ken Rideout
What was that like? How nerve-wracking? How'd you prepare? And um for people that don't know real quick your background prior to this you were a tech entrepreneur. And you had an exit.
Andrew Yang
Yeah.
Ken Rideout
So you had enough money to like
Andrew Yang
Yeah, find the first stage
Ken Rideout
And not work and focus on the on the campaign. So okay, talk me through the campaign. Like I'm so intrigued by this. Like were you nervous like the way I think you would be nervous?
Andrew Yang
I um did not know what it was going to be like. Um I should have been more nervous sort of. And so what what what I mean by this is that um it it took me one debate to figure out what the debates were.
Ken Rideout
Yeah.
Andrew Yang
Um which is they're not debates at all.
Ken Rideout
Right.
Andrew Yang
Um they're competitive theater performances.
Ken Rideout
Yes.
Andrew Yang
And you're there with nine other actors who all have lines that they want to get out. Uh and teams that rely upon them and moderators that have a particular um agenda and set of goals. So at first I was like, what is going on here? Um but then after one debate I was like, okay. And by the way, one of the things that clicked for me and I can't remember if this is in the book. Um but after the first debate my team was like, all right, we're going to hire a consultant
Ken Rideout
Yeah.
Andrew Yang
To prepare you for a TV debates which was not something I wanted to do or the team wanted to do. But the team was like, screw it. Like uh you know, um we're we're going to give it a shot. So then I sit with um the debate uh sorry like the prep trainer type.
Ken Rideout
Yeah.
Andrew Yang
And then he asks a sample question um like, what do you think about sex education? And I was like, that's a [ __ ] question. I would never get that question. Like that's not real. And then he said, no no, Bernie Sanders got that question in 2016. And I was like, you did? Then like, let me see the answer. So, they bring up the video of him answering the question, and it's 60 seconds of Bernie Sanders just being like, "Sex education is very important, and different communities feel this and that." And he didn't say any He didn't answer the question.
Ken Rideout
It's so frustrating as a viewer when they don't answer the question.
Andrew Yang
But he didn't answer the question for 60 seconds, and that's when a light bulb went off in my head. I was like, "Oh." Like, so um what you're supposed to do in that case is just blather, and wait until the time is up.
Ken Rideout
Blather, but then I the thing that's even more frustrating is they're like, "Yeah, sex education. Let me tell you though about universal basic income, how we can get do this and do that." I'm like, "That has nothing to do with the price of tea in China."
Andrew Yang
Dude, and so that is that was what the prep training was. Was um pretend to answer the question, and then pivot to your talking points.
Ken Rideout
You didn't need to pay the consultant. I could have looked at that and been like, "Here's what you got to do."
Andrew Yang
No, no, you're right. I should have paid you.
Ken Rideout
I would have done it for free.
Andrew Yang
So so then when you come to the debate then, post preparation, it's okay, here are the let's call it five things that you're going to want to get out regardless of what they ask you. Um and and then here are some things you can use to, you know, pivot to your talking points. And when you realize that's what everyone's doing, you're like, "Oh, now I see it in everyone's behavior and answers and the and the rest of it." Um so, that was a process, and uh I mean, the biggest thing was that it was the fourth or fifth debate where um I just gave money away during my intro because the team the team was like, "This debate's going to be a snooze.
Everyone's going to change the channel. If you do anything, it should be in your intro." And I was like, "Well, then what should I do?" And it's like, "Oh, like this campaign's about giving money away. Let's just give some money away." And uh So, that So, that that was the kind of thing that we would um sit around and talk about like before the debate. It's like, "What do you want to do this debate?"
Ken Rideout
Oh, cool. I There's so many things that like and I'm embarrassed that I don't remember all the specifics of the um debate.
Andrew Yang
No one does. Don't worry about it.
Ken Rideout
But I do remember being like, "I like this guy. Of all these candidates, that's my guy." And I just felt like, unfortunately, with our system, I just felt like there's no way he can win, but it's it's so frustrating because that's the guy. Like, he he should be He's more qualified than a lot of people. He's built a business, had an exit. And I remember this math
Andrew Yang
Make Americans think harder. Make Americans think harder. Didn't work.
Ken Rideout
But it was awesome. Like it it To me, it like resonated and I was like, "Okay, this guy is like different and not just like a stuffed suit up there talking the same nonsense." It's so incredibly frustrating. I'm actually interviewing my friend um Sean O'Brien in the next 2 weeks, the national president of the Teamsters. And it's just crazy to think like we went to high school together. He's like, to our earlier point, he's like a regular guy like you and I. He was like a crazy kid in high school.
I'd be like, "Oh, Sean's here." If everyone's drinking, I'm like, but he was like an inner-city tough kid. But that was who I grew up with. So, now to see him on a national stage speaking at the Republican Convention, the Democratic Convention when they have him, and listening to the candidates come and pander to them is crazy. And you know that um he tells this story. It's not any secret information, but that Kamala Harris came to see him and was like uh basically like she has, you know, X amount of minutes for you guys.
Most people come in and they're like, "Guys, what do you need?" And And she was like her her campaign was like same with Rogan. Like, "Here's what you can ask. Here's what we're doing." And he was like, "No, we're not agreeing to any of this." And she came in and she said to him famously, "We're going to win with or without you, so you better get on board." And like basically veiled threats, which you see all the time like Susan Rice on Netflix just said, "Wait until we get the White House back.
There's going to be payback for a lot of the stuff that's going on and people like remember Trump was like what are we doing? These are like you're on a board. You're not a politician. You're on a board of a public company. You can't talk about like pay political payback. It's just again not to beat a dead horse but it's all this same like retribution divisiveness. We're going to get you when we get a chance. But the interview with the Teamsters will be cool because no one is more involved.
I mean I'm sure you know from the campaign I have a bunch of wealthy real estate friends that have interactions with politicians. When you own an entire zip code in Queens for instance, you you're you need to know all the politicians. And some of the stories are just like how can someone be that unintelligent and corrupt to demand some of the things that they've that they've demanded. It's it's madness. I won't even repeat them but it's like you know that those things are happening and it's just
Andrew Yang
I can't imagine approaching Sean the Teamsters without being differential cuz like those dudes are it's like an army of freaking tough represents them, I mean jeez, like
Ken Rideout
For you to love I do love there is something that's like very almost patriotic about workers getting together and be like listen, we want to be treated fairly. However, I do think that some of these um unions and I don't want to say which ones cuz I'll be canceled and like destroyed in the comments. But some of these unions and their demands and the things that they're doing that are publicly funded I'm like
Andrew Yang
I ended up getting crossways with the teachers union as a result
Ken Rideout
Just going to say you're here to teach you're not here to like dictate political like policy on things like why is the teacher head of the teachers union in Ukraine or making international trips like to run your damn job. Do your job.
Andrew Yang
I I was endorsed by the police captains union and the firefighters union here in New York. And hanging out with those guys was one of the proudest moments of my life really and just like feeling like I was their guy. It's like, "Oh, dope." I mean, cuz these guys are, you know, literally running into burning buildings. They're like they risk their lives. Um so, I'm generally really pro-union, but then you know that at least some of them sometimes have had their own interests as opposed to like the, you know, the interests of the public.
Ken Rideout
Yeah. And for the record, like I love teachers. I think teachers do an incredible
Andrew Yang
Same. I mean, we all have kids.
Ken Rideout
Being a good teacher is a hard job. The ones that care, like I have four kids. I can see the teachers that care and I can see the teachers that are checked out. But I it's the union leadership, not teachers, that union leadership that irks me. I'm just like, "Why are you at political campaigns screaming and yelling and being like super one side or the other?" Like you represent Republicans and Democrats, whether you like it or not.
Andrew Yang
Yeah. No, I I'm I mean, we all see it, man. I mean, I'm a parent. I love good teachers. Um but then every once in a while you can sense that, you know, there's like an institutional interest that isn't necessarily lined up with what goes on in classrooms.
Ken Rideout
And I know we're on a I know we're on a tight schedule here, but before I go I wanted to I want to talk a little bit more about Noble Mobile. What was the um when you first conceived of it and when and reached out to the um to the carriers?
Andrew Yang
Yeah.
Ken Rideout
Obviously, you went with T-Mobile, but was were you met with any resistance or hesitation from any of them? Like get out of here, I don't need your help.
Andrew Yang
Uh this requires a little bit of background. Check it out. So, I was a Verizon customer for a long time. So, you know, and I when I joined Verizon, they were quote unquote the best network. And they were the best network here in New York. There was a real quality difference. But then somewhere over the last 25 years, like the the networks all went to 5G and are essentially equivalent in parity. And so, I was spending money on something that just wasn't um applicable anymore. So, when you talk about the different carriers now, in my view both Verizon AT&T have become kind of stodgy legacy carriers.
Uh and they're dividend stocks. Like Verizon's paying 6 and 1/2%.
Like a utility.
Yeah, they're they're utilities. They're cash transfer devices. Um and T-Mobile uh still feels like they're growing, like that you know, they're trying things. And so we got a much better hearing with them. Um and then the deal we got with them, you know, when the rubber hit the road, Ken, I was like, "Okay, if they give us a deal that's good enough where we can pass that deal along to Americans and still build a fine business, I, you know, it's freaking go time."
Ken Rideout
Yeah.
Andrew Yang
Um so so that was like the the major launching point. And the resistance we get from people is like, "How can this be possible?" And when I answer, it's like, "Look, it's possible because we're simply um getting gouged." You know, people look at it and be like, "Wait a minute, I can get unlimited data for whatever the number is, like, you know, 40 bucks, uh you know, 42 bucks, less in many cases." It's like, "Yes." And I know this in part cuz like I I was the first customer.
I I switched from Verizon to Noble. And even for me, even knowing everything I know, I was like, "Is my [ __ ] going to work?"
Ken Rideout
That's that was my biggest I've had AT&T since I've had a cell phone, the same exact phone number. And I was telling you when I met you, I'm like, "If you offered me $100, I wouldn't change. Like like if you said your phone's free, I would be like, "I don't want to change." But when I understood what what was going on, I was like, "This is crazy. Am I just a I'm just afraid to like do the transfer." Once I did the transfer and it kicked in, I was like, "Nothing on my phone changed." I'm not like, "One wasn't like, "Oh my god, this service is great." But I noticed I have like an extra $50 for every line in my house
Andrew Yang
At at a minimum.
Ken Rideout
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Like, "Am I stupid?" It just And you know what it did? It made me go home and look at my DirecTV bill, $350 a month. And I usually get one or two pay-per-view fights for like $70 a month, which is another crazy price gouge. And I realized three to $400 every single month on AT&T. And by the way, and I had YouTube TV cuz I was like, I need redundancy in case this one goes down cuz it's a satellite. I got rid of it and no one in my house missed a beat.
I don't miss having DirecTV. I have YouTube TV and like the HBO and like 10 different subscriptions, which probably comes to the same price, but I love not being beholden to the customer service at AT&T for DirecTV or the cell service was deplorable. It it it was like, I can't believe this exists.
Andrew Yang
You end up in a labyrinth and you can tell that uh you know, one of their strategies is like, maybe if we Yeah, if we make this difficult, maybe it'll just you know, go
Go away. Um but same phone, same phone number, you just connect to a different network and then you realize like, wait a minute. Um so even for me, I was like, is my [ __ ] going to work? And then when you realize your [ __ ] does work, to your point, Ken, you're like, oh my god, like a weight lifted. You're like, what else can I change?
Ken Rideout
Exactly.
Andrew Yang
What other bill can I re-examine and actually get an appropriate value for?
Ken Rideout
The price that I was paying for that DirecTV, my daughter's turning 16 in the summer. I'm leasing a full self-driving Tesla for her for the price essentially like $100 more than I was paying for DirecTV.
Andrew Yang
Yes. As someone who's like a numbers guy and like a bit of a financial nerd or whatever, the thing you have to uh be vigilant on is like recurring expenses.
Ken Rideout
Exactly.
Andrew Yang
Because uh like you think, hey, 50 bucks a month, no big deal. But it's like, wait a minute, you start doing the math, that's 600 a a year, put an interest rate a little bit more, and then that just stacks. Like uh and so if if you can get a recurring bill down, it's like freaking money in your pocket all the time.
Ken Rideout
Especially if you have an ounce of discipline, you say, you know what I'm going to do? I'm going to take that $400 every month and force myself to put it into like an ETF and leave it there. And then you see it compounding, you're like, I cannot believe what would this look like in 5 years? I do it with my kids specifically for that reason. I'm like, do you want to buy My son is obsessed with an electric bike and I'm like, "Dude, it goes 40 miles an hour.
You You like have two left feet. I'm not going to give you a motorcycle and like a kid died in the in the town that I'm in." Like, and I said, "I'm just not doing it." I said, "Imagine if you took the $1,000 you want to spend of your own money and you bought this stock. Look at what it's done." And they're like, it resonates with them because then he's like, "Well, then I could buy three electric bikes." I'm like, "That's not the point, dude."
But, parenting is a whole 'nother challenge.
Andrew Yang
Yeah, no. If you can get your kids to understand compounding and time value of money, I mean, like that's my passion, getting the numbers to work for someone. Uh and then you have a sense of optimism, entrepreneurship, possibility building. I've been in the opposite circumstance where it feels like the walls are closing in. And And then it's much, much harder to be um optimistic about opportunities because you think, "Oh, [ __ ] could go wrong." And then like the things start to get closed.
Ken Rideout
It can definitely go wrong, but guess what? It can also go right. And one of the things I tell my kids and I also coach the um helped coach the local cross country team um in Brentwood, Tennessee and the girls were like state champs, regional champs, went to nat- I mean, it was amazing. Dude, they were unbelievable. We trounced everyone. But, I would always tell the kids like, "Remember during this race, whatever you think, it's true. If you think you're hurting and you're not going to make it, like that's that's probably true." But, if you also tell yourself, "Everyone else is hurting and I'm just waiting to step on the gas." You don't even have to believe it, but if you can keep repeating it, occasionally it's going to go that way.
So, why waste your time talking negatively to yourself? And that goes with everything. It's like, yeah, 100 bucks a month, no big deal. But, if you take a second, you're like, "Yeah, it is a big deal. That extra $600, I got four kids. They're all going to go to college. Like, I've got to like a lot of expenses. Every little bit matters." How do people sign up for Noble? What Like, if if you bump into someone on the street, how What's the in 2 seconds, how do how do I get on Noble?
Andrew Yang
Yeah, you go to noblemobile.com. It takes typical person 5 to 10 minutes to switch. And I can't I don't know if you have your own link because if you do you can send people there and maybe have it in the show notes.
Ken Rideout
I will put in the show notes. I'll put a link up there and I'll also post it on Instagram.
Andrew Yang
Yeah, so we can make sure and give your people the best treatment. But shoot man, like savings is only 5 to 10 minutes away and we even have real life human beings there to pick up the phone.
Ken Rideout
Customer service there is the second to none. When I was there doing it, I mean I happen to be in the office but they were like do this, do that, click that, click that, boom done.
Andrew Yang
Yeah, we we thought you can't be the human carrier without employing real life humans. So it cost a little bit more but hey, you know, it'll pay off for the business. I'm I think people even listening to this you can sense that. You know, like I'm all about adopting new technologies but I'm also kind of old school.
Ken Rideout
Yeah, and do you talk about some of your investors? I know some of them are online.
Andrew Yang
Oh yeah, so Scott Galloway was one of the first investors.
Ken Rideout
I highlight that just to say like these are like people that I professionally respect and appreciate their thoughts on these on topics like finance etc. But that's the only reason I want to mention is like it's not like you know, a bunch of influencers. These are like real thought leaders in the business space. So keep going. I'm sorry.
Andrew Yang
Yeah, no of course. Scott Galloway, venture capital firm called Corazon Capital that's based in LA and Chicago. A private equity guy, like entrepreneurship. Um Or another couple funds. So we did like the the real thing, you know, and I could have raised money from just angels and people that I knew but I said you know what, let's get some pros on the cap table so that people know that there is someone um diligencing like our our carrier documents and everything else. It's like we're assuring for people.
Ken Rideout
For sure. And did everything is closed with the chief happiness officer, right?
Andrew Yang
Yeah, yeah. I see, you know.
Ken Rideout
Brooks, Dr. Arthur Brooks.
Andrew Yang
This is true. Arthur Brooks is an investor, literally the nation's happiness guru. You know, Harvard professor, teaches the most popular class in the country on how to be happy. You probably saw his column.
Ken Rideout
The unofficial chief happiness officer at Noble Mobile.
Andrew Yang
The unofficial chief happiness Dr. That's a very like yeah, and and we're going to be doing a lot with Arthur. He's a truly wise human. It's freaking awesome to be working with him and with you. I mean, you're like a a role model to so many, Ken.
Ken Rideout
I will tell you this like all [ __ ] aside like I don't promote anything that I don't genuinely believe in. I'm lucky in my life that I have what so many super rich people don't have and that's enough. I I definitely need to make more money. I'm far from like what I would call rich, but I have enough and I don't do things that I don't want to do. I'm not doing things out of necessity at this stage of my life. I'm doing things that I genuinely love and I would never promote a product or invest in a product that I didn't believe in wholeheartedly.
What you're doing is changing like the landscape for a lot of people and and really Arthur Brooks is the perfect investor and partner for a company that's trying to make you happier cuz if you don't think your phone is detracting deterring you from happiness like you're lying to yourself. Give it up for a month or give it up for a week.
Andrew Yang
One week.
Ken Rideout
I went to a place called Onsite Workshops that was like in patient intensive psychotherapy week like voluntary thing like the Hoffman Institute or Bridges. A lot of people have gone there and it's just intensive one-on-one therapy for like 5 days, but one of the things we do is leave your phone. And Lance and Lance Armstrong has spoken publicly about going there. He He was saying to me, yeah, when I left I didn't even want my phone back. I was like, oh I was having withdrawals from the phone, but I promise you I was so much more engaged.
When I had a free minute like at my house in the evening, I would if the you don't have the phone, I'm out like clowning with the kids tea like I'm big teaser with the kids. So they'll be watching TV and I'll just come over and like start harassing them and they'll be like, leave me alone. And then now we've taken all the remotes from the TV during the week. So there's no TV, there's no screens. And they're like, this is crazy. Our friends this, that friends that.
I said, I'm not worried about your friends. I Up until the last few years no one had these distractions.
Andrew Yang
Yeah.
Ken Rideout
Get good grades and here's the here's the system in our house. Like get these grades, you have this much time a week. But until you prove to me that you can handle that responsibility cuz right now you've shown me with these distractions, these things are suffering. When you're 18 you can make your own decisions, but for now you're going to do things the way I say. And we're old school that way.
Andrew Yang
No dude, every study has shown that you're in the right. And your kids will appreciate it later, 100%.
Ken Rideout
I try and tell them. I'm like, I have very rational conversations with them. I said, do you think that I'm telling you not to watch TV cuz I'm a jerk? Cuz I want what's wrong for you? You don't have to know what I know, but I've been doing this for 50 years longer than you have. I know. And eventually that like as they get in older they start to realize it. The little ones still are a little bit
Andrew Yang
I mean the the the thing that's the most worrisome, I know it's funny in my household we have, you know, it's like if we have them watch like a movie from beginning to end, it's like a victory now because it means their attention span's long enough. That the thing that we have to be vigilant about is if they have an iPad or a smartphone, worst of all social media, they shouldn't be on that stuff until they're a little bit older. But where where it's constant feedback, um particularly social feedback, like that's the stuff that really makes them anxious and and depressed and unable to concentrate.
I mean it's sort of funny cuz like when you you were growing up it's like, oh you watch much TV will rot your brain." At this point, I'd be like, "Oh, I'd be grateful if they watched TV." Especially TV sports. If I could get you to watch TV sports, it's like a freaking victory.
Ken Rideout
That's the only thing That's the only thing if we're like doing family stuff and there's on the weekends I'll put on sports and the kids will be like, "I thought we weren't watching TV." I said, "The Bruins are playing or the Celtics are playing or the Patriots." I'm like, "We're watching these games." But, I don't think a lot of parents appreciate it, but I also think that there is a level of laziness with some parents that are like, "Oh, they're driving me
Andrew Yang
Dude, it's so much easier.
Ken Rideout
Give them the iPad and they can check
Andrew Yang
Will sedate them and then you can sedate yourself and everyone's chill. Uh, you know, it's easier, but, you know, it teaches the kids the wrong lessons cognitively. It's just like it's just like, "Hey, shut your brain down."
Ken Rideout
But, you're also open to predators. I You would never think this would happen to you. So, my son, who's uh he's 14, um in eighth grade and he's playing lacrosse. And I was telling him like, "Look at what these people are doing on like Roblox and stuff." Guys, like I sit them all down and I'm like, "No girls are coming to approach you in the chat on Roblox and asking for nudes, you know, cuz they're like asking these kids for pics and then they're and then they're extorting them." I said, "No one is ever going to ask you for any of that.
And if someone ever did, you come and you tell me anything. I don't care what mistakes you make, but when you start trying to fix adult problems on your own, that's where you get in trouble." I always tell them, "It's not the crime that you commit in this house, it's the lying. I don't want it. When I When you If I ask you, 'Hey, did you do this?' and you know you did it, I already know you know it did it, too. That's why I'm asking.
So, my older son's like, I'm telling him all this, he goes, "Yeah, that happened to me." I go, "What?" He's like, "Yeah, this girl was was DMing me and at one point she was like, 'Oh, I play lacrosse, too.'" And he's like, "Oh, I play lacrosse." And and she's like, "Yeah, my I'm number eight." And he's number eight. And then he starts Thank god, he goes, "Dad, then I realized like, this is this is way too coincidental and he realized my avatar had a lacrosse picture with his number on it.
I'm like, "Dude, do you see girls are not in chats trying to get nude photos from boys. You understand that and vice versa. This is like these are grown men probably in another country. So, that's the stuff that really scares me cuz you don't want someone you want an adult, a manipulative predator in a like chat room with your like teen young teen child. It's very dangerous. So, I digress but yeah, I think what you're doing is great. I know you've got to run. I just want to say thank you so much.
I'm I'm incredibly proud of you. I'm proud to be involved with Noble and I'm proud to be your friend.
Andrew Yang
Ken, right back at you. Congrats on the awesome book and on being such an inspiration to so many including me.
Ken Rideout
Thank you, brother. I appreciate it. A lot of ways it's just a survival story, you know. I'm I'm literally doing the best I can just trying to get through and I'm so happy that the book is resonant. By the way, I pulled up did I never I hadn't looked yesterday when I met my friend Rafael who does like content for me. He goes, "By the way, you know your book is best seller in Amazon." I was like, "No, no, no. It just came out. It doesn't come out for a week." He's like, "No, pull it up." And it literally has a red banner.
Number one best seller in running and jogging and in all of sports number two new releases.
Andrew Yang
Dude, congratulations.
Ken Rideout
Thank you, brother. That's like I have some huge media coming up that hasn't been released yet. I did interviews with Nick Bare, Rich Roll and I have Guardian article coming up like
Rich is my man. I've done it three ti- I've done his show three times. He's been a guest on this podcast. He's a good man. Do you know him?
Andrew Yang
Not only do I know him, but it seems like he might be working with us on Noble.
Ken Rideout
Yeah, he said he was. I talked to him about it at length cuz I was talking to him about some of the different kind of deal structures he's put together and I said, "Yo, use me as a resource." One that I just did and he's like, "Oh, I'm talking to him." I don't know if he said he was did he did it but
Andrew Yang
We're we're in like the last uh stretch. But yeah, I I like Rich a lot.
Ken Rideout
Well, I put in a good word for you. He was like excited about it. So
Andrew Yang
Yeah.
Again, the noble crew.
Yes.
Ken Rideout
Yes.
And again, if you haven't picked up a copy of the book, please do. Shameless plug. Everything you want is on the other side of hard, available for sale everywhere you buy books on March 10th. Be on the lookout. I'm going to do some live events in New York, LA, Miami, London, Boston, and uh who knows? At the New York event, you may be lucky enough to meet the great Andrew Yang.
Andrew Yang
Everything you want, other side of hard. That's it.
Ken Rideout
Boom. Thank you. All right, guys. I hope you enjoyed that conversation as much as I did. Please take a quick minute to subscribe to the podcast wherever you're listening. This is a new show, so subscribing makes a huge difference. Please also take a minute to give it a review and leave a comment on Apple Podcast and on Spotify. You can also subscribe and leave a comment on YouTube. Again, this is really important for us, especially now since we're just getting started.
You can learn more about me, this podcast, and also find links to purchase my upcoming memoir at the other side of hard.com. My new book is called Everything You Want Is on the Other Side of Hard and it comes out March 10th, available everywhere you buy books. Or again, go into the other side of hard.com. There's multiple links there where you can find all the retailers carrying the book.
Thanks a lot for being with us and we'll see you next week.
Key takeaways
- Meeting people in power can make public leadership seem more approachable and worth challenging.
- Independent media can help a campaign reach people outside the usual political channels.
- AI and automation may disrupt work before institutions are ready to respond.
- Wireless customers can question whether legacy pricing still matches the service they receive.
- Clear limits on phones and social media can help children build attention and safer habits.
- Building a practical alternative is one way to respond to a broken system.
Nowhere to Hide
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